People still think EU nstionals are being treated fairly in the UK?

I'm sure they do, lemongrove, but if (hypothetically) a very high percentage of patients going into hospital for a simple operation were killed unnecessarily (25% for example), while the majority were fine, I don't think you'd find it acceptable.

Are you suggesting the cases aren't real because they're in the Guardian? Do you mean a bit like the cases of families with 13 children all on benefits in the Daily Mail?

growstuff
Not a sensible comparison.
Any bureaucratic excercise like this one ( especially trying to do it quickly) is bound to have some difficult cases.
What makes anyone think that any EU citizen who applies properly won’t have their application processed, even if it takes longer?
Posters are looking for the worst possible outcomes.

jura2.....could it possibly be your comments that those who voted Leave should be denied essential medication and procedures if there are any shortages ??
Had you really forgotten so soon?

Not forgotten at all.

There is a rising number of 'unusual' cases coming up now- a lot of them affecting elderly and sick people. The stress and pain caused is huge

uk.reuters.com/article/uk-britain-eu-immigration/sick-and-elderly-some-eu-nationals-struggle-to-prove-uk-residency-ahead-of-brexit-idUKKBN1W41KN?fbclid=IwAR0Efmr14ZmW2iMRVCzHqVAGyqn6SPtP1Xq5DryGAt4RdULyN2b-8Pligr4

“Ok, they’ve maybe got a system which works well for young people who’ve got all the documentation, etcetera, but they seem to have made no allowances whatsoever for elderly people - perhaps from difficult backgrounds - who are not quite as IT-literate,”

many of them have no family to help, no I-phone or Computer either.

I posted on another thread about what happened today, my daughters care agency has given a months notice as they are so so short staff after many of their, mainly EU nationals have left and left the country. This agency is a large charity and they pay their staff above average and also provide transport. Most of the staff have been in place long term. But they are fed up with Brexit and the hoops they are having to jump through.

So now my daughter is at risk with her care and also with the possibility of insulin shortage and other medication.

I have been speaking personally to two … err … "difficult cases" this week, both people I have known for years.

1 A hospital consultant, who has worked for the NHS for over 20 years. He works in a specialist field and patients come to him from all over the country for treatment. A German national with two children born in the UK.

2 A lady in her mid 60s, who has lived in the UK since she came as an au pair at the age of 18. She married a police officer, to whom she is still married, and had four children born in the UK. Her husband's work made it difficult for her to have a career, although she has worked for some years doing fairly low paid work, such as childcare and shop work. She hasn't kept all her paperwork from paying tax and NI. She's a Danish national.

Both have been denied settled status. Why are these cases "difficult"? they have lived here legally, have not been a drain on the country's resources and have records, but presumably not the right ones.

Both are now starting the process of appealing, which could cost many hundreds if not thousands of pounds.

I hope the leavers are pleased with themselves.

Official figures:

" In April of this year, when the system officially began, 66% of applicants received settled status. Today the percentage has fallen to 57%."

and as said, the 'elderly' and women are really having issues.

I believe this settled status scheme was rushed through. Most of us know from experience that things that are rushed seldom work properly. One problem is that all EU nationals are treated as one homogenous group. They obviously are not. Another big problem is that the application is linked to a passport. Passports expire. In the Scandinavian society I belong to several very elderly ladies no longer have a passport because they do no longer travel abroad. I guess many elderly Brits are in the same position. For EU nationals, however, the lack of a valid passport bars them from applying for settled status.

I now expect that I will be told by some posters that these are only minor teething problems and things will sort themselves out and also they have a daughter-in-law/friend etc and they have applied for settled status and it only took them 10 minutes. Good for them. I guess they are not eighty/ninety years old with various health issues. The actual application procedure requires that you have an Android phone with NFC function and that you can use this phone confidently, download an app and take a photo of yourself and your passport and answer several questions.

Also, even if your application is successful that is not the end of it. Every time you renew your passport/change address etc you have to update your records. Don't forget that Boris Johnson, Priti Patel and Michael Gove promised that EU nationals would automatically be granted indefinite leave to remain in the UK. There is nothing automatic about this scheme.

Recently I had a very sad conversation with a lady. She has just suffered a stroke and said she hoped she would die before she had to apply for the right to stay in this country that has been her home for 60 years.

Watch this, and say this is fair:

www.facebook.com/bbcbreakfast/videos/2429495540666837/

the elderly and the sick are the most at risk, no support for some, no techical skills or access to technology, lack of awaress, etc.

I have posted before that my daughter has lost a large percentage of her carers, EU nationals, not because of poor conditions as that had been addressed but because they felt unwelcome here. I was also asked by SS if I would take direct payments for her care and take over the employing of her carers. I am very nearly 72, live a 110 country miles round trip away and thats what they wanted me to do. NO was the answer.

Anyway i think EU nationals are bing treated unfairly in this country and also its hostile to them. Leave EU so they can't come anymore, but what about our Ex pats how are they treated in their country of choice.

Sorry folks I have already posted this information and now I have repeated myself. Just so angry.

Can't blame you, for sure.

So so worried for my friend and ex neighbour in UK. I told you her story before- she is severely handicapped and nearly 80, and widowed from her British husband- living in a Council bungalow. She has been invited to go and visit family in the Loire Valley, by a couple of British friends who are going on holiday in France by car- so she can have the whole of the back seat, with pillows, etc, to travel. Which is wonderful as otherwise she would NOT be able to make the journey- they will pick her up as they return 2 weeks later- after 31st of October. I do not have the heart to tell her she is taking a huge risk, and yet I so worry in case she has trouble with immigration, let alone huge delays.

So retired British expats all over the EU got their letters today- confirming they will no longer be covered for health care under Form S1. Some of them a are very elderly, in middle of treatment, etc, and are really worried and scared.

Read today a desperate message from a British couple who have been working in France for many years. They are covered in the French system. But 2 years ago, theiy brought their elderly and frail father, who could not cope on his own anymore, to live with them. That was not problem, in the EU, and his health care covered by S1. He has no-one left in the UK, nothing to return to. They are worried sick- and he is desperately worried that he will be un unbearable burden.

Can any of you imagine what that is like???

We have received our letters, to say that as the UK has signed a reciprocal treaty, we will still be covered, and Pensions unchanged. Well- apart from exchange rates that is ... and Sterling will probably tank soon, even further.

Perhaps those of you who think that is 'fair'- could give practical and humane advice as to what they should do. Thanks.

The government sound very organised. Isn’t healthcare going to be provided to ex pats on a country by country basis? I thought it was up to each of the 27 (26?) member states to decide what they have planned?

I agree though jura2 that this must be a great worry for all over there who are caught up in this.

However 3 years down the line, perhaps some (admittedly not all) could have been making their own plans. Perhaps they just decided to enjoy the 3+ years in the sun and see how things panned out.

Maybe the EU will be able to negotiate some sort of reciprocity now the talks are entering the final stage (of the beginning). But yes, in the meantime it must be awful for many but I don’t see it’s the U.K. at fault here. We have agreed provision for over 3 million EU citizens living here - Mrs. May promised them the government would take care of them, that they were very welcome etc.

Surely it’s time for the EU to do similar?

What plans could they have made for an 89 year old father who they found was no longer able to cope on his own? Left him to fester? Really. They brought him over knowing that he would be covered.

Why should the EU pick up the tab for a decision which was not of their own making at all.

From the NHS website:

For example, if you're a current S1 form holder, or a posted worker or student using a European Health Insurance Card (EHIC), you will not be able to use these to access your healthcare as you do now if there's a no-deal Brexit.

(My highlight)

So jura2 it seems if a deal can be reached, which the U.K. government wants, there’s nothing to worry about. It’s all if there’s NO DEAL.

So worrying, yes, but not definite yet.

And this in the context that 1000s upon 1000s are planning their escape currently. The brightest, and those with the most desirable skills (but who will worry so much about leaving elderly parents behind- often elderly parents who voted for leave too) ...

Reading further on the NHS website it says:

‘Living in the EU after Brexit

You should review your access to healthcare now. There may be a gap or permanent change in how you access healthcare if there's a no-deal Brexit and no arrangements with EU countries in place.

Some EU countries have made no-deal healthcare offers. You should check the living in country guides on GOV.UK, or the country guides on the NHS website, to find out if this is the case in your country of residence.

You need to make the best decisions for your circumstances and consider:

registering to live in your country of residence
registering for healthcare under the local rules and legislation of the country you live in – you may need to be a long-term legal resident or pay social security contributions to access free or discounted healthcare
buying comprehensive health insurance while you're applying for residency or if you're not eligible for local schemes’

“Page last reviewed: 23 September 2019
Next review due: 23 September 2022”

The current letters say 'the UK is leaving on 31st of October'

Wow! They know more than we do!

Sorry, a joke - probably in poor taste jura2 given the circumstances.

Do you think the letters have been sent to force everyone to evaluate the situation urgently? I suppose this day was, to some degree, always on the cards.

Anyone who moved to live full time in the EU in the last 3 years must have known they were taking a chance to some degree.

It must be heartbreaking for some families out there. I don’t know the answer.