A very English Brexit

I'd direct that question towards Boris Johnson, if I were you. The truth is nobody knows (after three years). I doubt if Johnson knows either, but he might give you a frozen kipper for your efforts.

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Why is the original post hypocrical?

rose the really sad thing is that the working classes are the ones who (as usual) are going to suffer most from the consequences of Brexit. The Westminster wealthy including (especially) the leavers are going to benefit enormously.

What an enormous and successful con-job.

No-one has suggested that Turkey will be joining the EU. Although personally, I don’t see that as a problem.

Benefits of being in the EU...

49hr working time directive that the Tory govt. tried to get out of. Personally, I don’t want my junior doctors and nursing staff working such ridiculously long hours!

EU funded research. Without the money from the EU our Universities will drastically drop down the world university rankings and your grandchildren and great grandchildren won’t thank you for that. They’ll gave to pay to study overseas if they want a quality 3rd level education.

Smoke free workplaces

Cross border policing and European wide arrest warrants. Where do you think European criminals will choose to hang out if the U.K. is no longer part of the EU?

Ditto co-operative counter agency terrorist intelligence services....

Improved consumer protection laws and product labelling rules.

Cleaner beaches.

Very long list of buildings and projects paid for entirely by the EU that wouldn’t have happened if it was left to a Tory govt. Tory govt. policy is to reduce capital expenditure. Look at how they’ve cut the NHS budgets so they can’t even offer basic services without ludicrous waiting lists.

The consultant agreed that it needed doing but I couldn’t even get on a waiting list for my hernia OP in the UK because it wasn’t deemed serious enough. I moved to Ireland and went to see my GP and went straight on the public health list and got it operated on within 6 months.
You’re very mistaken if you still believe that the NHS is the best health service in the world. It’s dropping rapidly down the world rankings as there’s not enough investment in it.

Erm this will not happen if we have our way! Whilst they make all the noise, quietly in the background the remain campaign made up of millions is beavering away. Yes I am part of this so know what's going on.

They expected us to give up and go away. Well we wont. Those who do, are quietly doing it in the background. The media dont want to report it cos it doesnt suit their political agenda

Anyway we dont and wouldnt allow alot of what we do (my part is minuscule in compare) to be known.

Those on the back foot shout the odds. Quietly does, the remainers and anyway you dont show the "enemy" your hand

If they did succeed on taking us out, the battle isnt over either, as the fight will begin to take us back in and fight the future relationship,however it wont be as good a deal as we have now cos the E.U wouldn't allow it.

Incase your wondering the Cons want us out this year cos of the codisal being added to the Lisbon Treaty, that came out in 2009.

The codisal is to stop the greed of the bankers from the banker crash from 2008 happening again where the public have to pay for it and the bankers move their money to offshore tax havens. The cons dont want that nor does Farage who remember is originally a city businessman

The Cons want to turn this country into a tax haven. That is what leave voters, voted for, with the Cons hidden agenda. You didnt know it however you wouldnt have known it, as you were sold a lie

This idea that our financial contribution gets us no benefits is Leave propaganda. We got the benefits of the EU negotiating free trade with over 80 countries, we are now having to count the cost of tearing up dozens of treaties and reinvent the wheel with many dim old Etonians at the helm deciding what is best for them and imposing it on the rest of us whether we like it or not. That’s going to cost far more than our EU contribution. Does anyone believe the £350m a week for the NHS bus lie? My MiL still does, but fortunately she says she’s never voting again. Just because a politician is British doesn’t mean they are any good or have the interests of the country at heart. That’s obvious.

Not wanting to add any more ire to this fiery post this morning, but I thought this John Bird & John Fortune sketch from 1996 sums it up nicely:

www.youtube.com/watch?v=f6a_weyzkY4&feature=youtu.be

Yet again too much them and us. WE ARE PART OF THE THEM sorry for the shout but it feels necessary.

I saw a film clip this morning which I will change slightly for the sake of politeness. Leaving the EU is like booking into a hotel and going to your room, pulling back the bed covers and using the bed as a loo. Then you realise that you still have to sleep in it!

Yes, the rich are making money out of it so we keep hearing how bad the EU is. I accept that there is much wrong with it as there is with our own parliament but surely we should work out whether it is better to be in or out, not just complain about what's wrong.

Sometimes when I'm waiting for a but I will hear "it was so much better before they changed it to a number 4". Perhaps it was but they are still using the bus instead of walking.

Borntosew, I do understand how you feel. It really does get people showing their true colours, doesn't it. The best thing is to stick to the non-political threads.

Personally I am very pleased that so many of the older generation are still concerned about what is happening in our country. They haven't retired from life just because they have grown old.

Craicon - actually BJ did support Turkey joining the EU. In an article in the Telegraph (27/09/2016) he is quoted as saying that Britain would support Turkey's campaign to join and there is also a video of him on You tube on the same subject.

Since when have the French refused British goods...(apart from probably mad cows) they ve always been strangely found of baked beans, bacon, English tea, culture, parliamentary system and quaint customs. They (and the other 26) have admired the English for years and are feeling let down and, frankly, sad!
we all vote for the EU MEPs. you cannot have the same type of democracy for 27/28 countries than for one country. I think what is happening here now should make you think about UK's democracy ... anon elected government thinking of ignoring parliament, a referendum led like a tombola, full mof lis and manipulation....the list is long.
What has the EU done that harmed you personally?

Yes I did and have recommended others watch it too. It’s chilling what they got away with then and continue to get away with now.

Well said, Cindersdad! I agree wholeheartedly!

The 48 hour working week is a bit unusual. Junior doctors often work 60, 70 80 hour weeks but as long as it averages out to 48 a week then it's ok.

You can also opt-out of this if you wish to work longer hours. Which I think is good. It's up to the individual.

EU funded research? We fund the research as well! Also, having a cancer research scientist in my life they've been assured that there will be minimal issues. Apart from anything else we work with countries all round the world. My son attends far more conferences in USA and Asia, than Europe.

I think a lot of the laws that the EU has passed are laws that have been adopted in the western world. Smoking at work/public places would most definitely have been banned, EU or no EU.

As for the NHS. This is one area when I wish we were more like our EU counterparts and funded the EU in a more responsible way. It's failing and no amount of money will fix it.

What is a codisal, Keffie?

We must remember that a lot of these things are government policy, not rules made by the EU. These problems won't go away when we leave.

Animal welfare is one area where the EU has been a good influence. Those of us who care about it, must make our voices heard.

I listened to Sir Paul Nurse who is head of the Francis Crick institute talk about how disastrous Brexit will be for science and medicine. It was very scary especially for anyone with a medical condition.

there are very very good reasons why the right wing privileged establishment wanted out of the EU - because they were about to bring in laws to stop non taxable offshore holdings. Brexiteers manipulated and appealed to the insecurity of peoples' racism tapping into islamophobia and immigration that has nothing to do with the EU. But mainly, ironically, giving people a voice to upset the apple cart after austerity had such a bad effect...food banks fo working people - humiliating. If they are hurting why not hurt others. It's tragic. The EU may be a cumbersone great bureaucracy but it it will always work together over workers rights, women's rights, human rights, climate change...do not expect progressive politics from Johnson et al...they treat the common man/woman like fodder and are laughing all the way to the bank. poor Brexiteers are turkeys voting for Christmas. The top earners have got richer since austerity...the poor have got poorer. Don't forget that glorious past so many Brexiteers crave - the height of the Victorian Empire when Britain ruled the waves and the world we had the poorest people on the planet, no education, no hospitals only workhouses...and boy was the nation rich...I have been proud to be part of Europe, many times ashamed of being British when they show their arrogant ignorant nationalism. We'll just become a second rate State of the USA...where only those that have get...woe betide if you fall between the cracks. It is so depressing.

I’m very patriotic and would be very open to independence if it weren’t for several nasty facts! UK has grown to be 6th largest economy under EU and we make colossal amounts out of EU clearing. The referendum was voted on based on lies like £234 million into NHS, less immigration, Turkey joining EU. Boris’s speeches are written by Steve Bannon , a US troublemaker who got Trump in with racist type views and who is trying to destroy the EU for benefit of Russia and America. Farage received millions from Russia via Aaron Banks , why? Trump said NHS was on the table in US deal and I believe him he’s too stupid to cover things up. Cummings is not an MP and is spending 1 million pounds printing leaflets to convince you Brexit no deal is good , if it was , it wouldn’t need leaflets. Who pays him? Sorry but too much about Brexit no deal stinks. Yes it’s an English Brexit and I hope Scotland leaves and does what Southern Ireland did which is thrive. We as grannies have a duty to our GC’s after all don’t we have the wisdom of experience ? A no deal Brexit will impact young families the hardest ! I’m worried for them not me as I don’t have to be in UK if it gets bad. I welcome all grannies opinions and all sides , and always open to other views! I also appreciate some ladies are not interested but there are other threads for them.

"Sorry, Brussels 'rules' everybody in the UK - using an unelected, unaccountable team, who love to dispense your money with open hands. They build motorways in Madeira, bridges in Barcelona, and 'support' Welsh sheep farmers with our own money, all the while despising us and refusing (French) to put our products on the shelves of their supermarkets."

What a lot of tosh, GraceGranMK3 - We do elect our MEPs, y'know. And have you visited France much? There are plenty of international products on their shelves, though in truth their fresh food is far better than ours (see any small town's weekly market). As for supporting our farmers: well I'm dreading what's going to happen to our farming and fishing industries after Brexit. They get masses of input from the EU and yet mainly voted out. I'm wondering what they'll do for hands-on labour when they can no longer get either the staff or subsidies.

Linda369 - apparently the Crick Institute is no longer being invited to participate in research projects.

By the way I don’t believe US desperate for a no deal Brexit whilst ripping up the nuclear arms treaty with Russia are a coincidence .

British people who voted Brexit wanting to see Britain become independent and great again have actually caused us to become the biggest laughing stock ever and seen as being totally controlled by Trump ! I travel a lot and a few years ago being English was respected, revered even , now it just opens the doors to pity , sympathy, sneering, raised eyebrows, sadness, and snarky grins. I would never have believed in 2016 how fast we would go downhill in people’s estimation! I naively thought it wouldn’t make much difference. I’m sad when a labourer on 400 Euros pm in East Europe thinks my country is stupid.

When are they going to realise that most of what has been going on is illegal? The laws in this country are made by Parliament, elected by the people, and not by the people directly, referendum or not. It was illegal for Cameron and May to declare that Brexit MUST happen because on one day in 2016 a very slim majority in a referendum came out in favour of it. Nothing in the British constitution has changed, and a referendum is only supposed to be a gauge of popular opinion. If they had held a referendum on Unicorns for All, even if it had come out as 75% in favour, if it proved to be undeliverable by Parliament, no amount of storming the Palace of Westminster or bleating about "democracy" would make it deliverable. Brexit appears to be turning out tha same. BY LAW the decision has to be made by Parliament.

To those Leavers who counter the suggestion that they didn't know what they were voting for, by turning it round and saying remainers didn't know either, I need to remind you that Leave meant making a change, for good or bad, while Remain meant keeping the status quo. So Remain voters knew EXACTLY what they voted for, because they already had it. There's been plenty of "what kind of Brexit did you think you were voting for" but it would be a nonsense to ask "what kind of Remain did you think you were voting for" because by definition, it was for what we already knew. There isn't more than one kind of remain.

"Faceless bureaucrats in Brussels telling us what to do" is either forgetting or ignorant of the fact that we have an equal part in all these decisions and "our money" which is being used to build "bridges in Barcelona" is actually the EU's money, to which we contribute only a small amount, and is also used for things like rebuilding the centres of cities like Liverpool.