Gransnet forums

News & politics

Brexit lies

(13 Posts)
varian Fri 06-Dec-19 17:13:58

A senior British diplomat in the US has quit with a blast at the UK government over Brexit, saying she could no longer "peddle half-truths" on behalf of political leaders she did not "trust."

In a searing resignation letter delivered just over a week before the UK general election, Alexandra Hall Hall, the lead envoy for Brexit in the British Embassy in Washington, said that she had become increasingly dismayed by the demands placed on the British civil service to deliver messages on Brexit which were not "fully honest."
The reluctance of Britain's leaders to play straight with the public on Brexit, Hall Hall said, had undermined the credibility of UK diplomats abroad. Her position had become "unbearable personally" and "untenable professionally," she wrote in the letter, which has been obtained by CNN.

Civil servants and diplomats have to obey the instructions of their political masters but should that include colluding in lies?

Whitewavemark2 Fri 06-Dec-19 17:32:03

It is getting pretty serious isnt it?

varian Sat 07-Dec-19 15:51:54

Though Hall Hall did not refer to Johnson or any other UK leader by name in her letter, she expressed concern about the divisive rhetoric that has characterized British politics since the Brexit referendum. Johnson's comments have hardened in recent months. He has attacked attempts to prevent a no-deal Brexit as "surrendering" to Brussels and dismissed fears that his language encourages supporters to abuse his opponents. Johnson has defended his rhetoric, telling the BBC after a particularly rancorous parliamentary debate in September that avoiding such terms risked "impoverishing the language and diminishing parliamentary debate".

Much of the blame for the strategy has been pinned on Johnson's lead adviser,Dominic Cummings.

Urmstongran Sat 07-Dec-19 17:12:47

Most intelligent and successful negotiators in business recognise the advantage of being able to walk away if a proposed offer on the table isn’t deemed good enough.

That’s all No Deal is.

Neither side wants it but it focuses minds to be serious.

varian Sat 07-Dec-19 17:44:11

Trying to use the threat of No Deal brexit as a negotiating poly is nonsense. It is like threatening to shoot yourself if you don't get your own way. This is one of the fallacious arguments the brexitories use.

It is not analogous to walking away from a car showroom if you don't get a good deal. If you do that you've still got your old car and your money. You have lost nothing. Brexit makes us losers.

Alexandra Hall Hall just got fed up peddling brexit lies and trying to defend the indefensible. No wonder she resigned.

crystaltipps Sat 07-Dec-19 17:46:45

If you don’t do a deal in business you stay the same as you are - you don’t rip everything up and start from zero which is what no deal would be.

varian Sun 08-Dec-19 11:20:28

Here is a list of recent lies

Urmstongran Sun 08-Dec-19 11:30:34

No Deal means we walk away if the EU doesn’t try hard enough. It’s not in their interests to and I can understand that. If they give us too much other EU countries will start to question whether they might prefer to Exit.

Remember Macron saying he didn’t dare offer a referendum to the French because he feared they would also vote to Leave?

But a No Deal works because it removes from the negotiating table some of the things the EU want. Money. Fishing rights. Etc.

Neither side ‘want’ it but it has to be there.

ClareAB Sun 08-Dec-19 11:47:39

People were sold a Fantasy Brexit that is impossible to deliver. I would like to see lying by politicians made illegal. How can anyone make a decision based on personality politics and spin?

whywhywhy Sun 08-Dec-19 11:54:55

Politicians lie! NEVER!!!!! The whole thing has been a farce from day one and I think they should have gone for another referendum instead of this stupid Election which Boris seems bound to win! Farce!

Whitewavemark2 Sun 08-Dec-19 11:55:45

There was a time when a politician was forced to resign if found guilty of lying.

Calendargirl Sun 08-Dec-19 12:04:36

Politicians have always lied. I can remember my dad saying that when Harold Wilson (Labour) de-valued the pound, back in the 60’s I suppose, Wilson said ‘it would make no difference to the pound in your pocket’.
Well, apparently, it did!
For the worse.

pinkquartz Sun 08-Dec-19 12:11:51

I can remember my Dad telling me when I was at Primary school that all politicians lie.
The trouble is there are no consequences for them, only for us.

If people are voting for Johnson because they are afraid of Corbyn how will that ever work out?
We shall soon see.
I have never had such a feeling of dread over an election before.