Is this the beginning of the end for the United Kingdom?

the first lady
Nicola Sturgeon is not the first lady.
She is the first Minister of the Scottish Parliament.

For the time being at least, the First Lady is HM the Queen.

If Scotland does become independent they can choose a President who may or may not be a woman.

Regardless of formulas that divvy up UK taxpayers money. It is fair to say that those taxpayers in living in England by virtue of larger population numbers make the larger contribution to the Exchequer. No I don't follow Scottish politics, my point being is that the request ought to come via the Scottish Parliament rather than hubristic reaction to the GE result. As to the cost. There is the cost of the referendum to be met, is this in the Scottish Parliament's budget? If successful the cost of dismantling current administration structures. Setting up new administration. Currency, defence, security, common infrastructure to be considered. Then of course the cost of rejoining the EU. Where is Scotland going to find the funding for this? I assume through some transition agreement with monies coming from Westminster. It is a complex matter. If Scotland want independence that's fine, my point being that the people of should Scotland finance it.

You specifically said that the English taxpayer would foot the bill though - can you explain what you mean by that?

There will no doubt be a cost to a subsequent English Govt if Scotland and N Ireland decide to go their separate ways, but as with leaving the EU, that’s something that will have to be borne - that’s where the politicians get round the table and negotiations begin.

I stand corrected on SP vote which I see took place in 2017

If after a vote they want independence, of course they should have it. But that means a complete break, they should be financially self supporting, no money from Westminster. If they feel happier being a part of Europe rather than the Uk it is their decision. I find it sad they want to separate from UK however, but I do wonder how many really want to. Perhaps if going it on our own proves to be good, they might feel a bit happier about staying as part of the UK.

If N Ireland and Scotland decide to be independent then of course we won’t receive money from WM - what an odd thing to even mention.

Given that Brexit is a process which will take years and has no clear direction or outcome it’s obviously going to be a difficult decision for many. Boris will have to move much further to the centre, show character and leadership skills that are sadly lacking at the moment and come up with clear and immediate benefits for the whole of the UK - because at the moment the independence parties are doing very well up here. I imagine there are many like me who could be persuaded to hold their noses and vote for independence if it meant that we could remain in the EU.

SirChenjin
I have done some reading on the distribution of UK tax revenue this morning. All of the devolved administrations receive proportionally higher share per capita than England. London and the South East generate the largest portion of revenue and subsidize the remainder of the UK. As per my previous email there will be a cost to Scottish independence which has to be met and Scotland will need to meet its own defence and security costs, border control costs, as well as ongoing health, education, policing, infrastructure etc. The choice may be either they borrow and service their own fiscal debt or there will be some transition arrangement whereby these monies come from current HM borrowing and tax revenues. In the latter case the subsidization will continue and English taxpayers principally in London will be contributing significantly under the existing formula, certainly in the short term.

Callistemon Whilst there are a few republicans about, there is no plan to replace the Queen with a President.. There is no Queen of Great Britain, Elizabeth is Queen of both the United Kingdoms i.e. Scotland and England. If her 2 Kingdoms become disunited then she will still be Queen of England and separately Elizabeth, Queen of Scots. The Scottish Crown Jewels are kept in Edinburgh Castle and were taken to the Parliament building (though not worn by the Queen) for the opening ceremony of the new Scottish Parliament.

Yes, that's right, it's called the Barnett formula. However, you specifically said that the English tax payers would foot the bill if Scotland and N Ireland voted for independence - and that's simply not the case. There would be costs associated with this breakup of the union across the UK, as there are with Brexit, and negotiations with the resulting Govts would then ensue, but it's incorrect to say that people in England would foot the entire bill.

If you have been looking at the GERS statistics, please be aware that they do not tell the whole story and are full of anomalies e.g.

In addition, whisky consumed in the UK is subject to VAT and alcohol duty. This is assigned to Scotland on the basis of *how much is consumed in Scotland*

Surely as an entirely Scottish Product, the huge revenue generated for the UK exchequer should ALL be credited to the Scottish economy? Also Tax payers in Scotland number just short of 10% of all UK tax payers yet spending in Scotland is based on it having 9.1 % of the UK population. Remember too that Tony Blair, sneakily, moved the Scotland/England sea boundary to England's advantage, putting more oil, gas and fish into England's economy at the expense of Scotland's economy.

Also the largest chunk of Defence spending. i.e. the cost of Trident's base, is attributed to Scotland because that is where it is located. An Independent Scotland would not want this in our Country, would instead spend a more modest sum on conventional defense.

Finally, if you do take these statistics at face value, then please consider that this alleged deficit has occurred within a United Kingdom. I am sure that GNs in the North or Southwest of England would agree that there has been, for generations, an unfair distribution of wealth and Public Spending throughout this land.

Would Scotland want to become a member of the Commonwealth, I wonder, if they should become independent?

I still cannot see how, if Scotland should become an independent country, HM Queen will remain your Head of State unless you become a member of the Commonwealth.
Crown jewels or not.
Presumably the Acts of Union will be repealed.

Perhaps I'm missing something.

That’s certainly something else for discussion but this is a good article from 2014 www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-29126569

Callistemon, You're not!!

It's not just me then!

I will bookmark that for later SirChenjin

Quoted: "If Scotland or Northern Ireland have a majority vote to leave then that must be respected. A bit odd not wanting to be part of a four country union but wanting to become a tiny cog in a group of 27+ countries with more hoping to join."

Get the engineering metaphor right. A tiny cog in a large machine pulls more than a cog in a small machine.

Precisely Alexa. Better to govern ourselves and have a seat at the top table of the big Club, than be subservient to our bigger neighbour, whose 10x larger electorate means that we can never outvote or overrule them.

I don't get it. Scotland don't want to be part of the UK, but want to be part of the EU. Surely, they still wouldn't have independence?

We'd be an equal partner sitting at the table with the other EU nations.
We would no longer be at the mercy of W M, vastly outnumbered by English mp's.
Surely that's obvious!

We (and N Ireland, if that's the route they go down) will be part of the EU as an independent, sovereign nation (like the other members) or in some kind of trade arrangement e.g. like Norway. It boils down to whether enought people here and in N Ireland feel there are more benefits to being part of the EU versus being part of a UK with a vague Brexit path and Boris at the helm. At the moment for me - and I'm sure many others - it's trying to work out which brings more benefits and opportunities and minimises harm to our communities, economy, access to markets and so on. I'd need to see something concrete re our arrangement with the EU from Sturgeon before I voted for independence, but if she could get that then I think she could get her indy wish.

Is there any guarantee that an independent Scotland would be able to join the EU let alone be given a “seat at the top table”?

Disentangling Scotland or/an N Ireland from the union is almost certain to cost English Taxpayers a very substantial amount. Ignoring the arguments of relative transfers of national wealth between the various nations there is the need to replace investments, like that at Faslane and ship building facilities on the Clyde unless the English are willing to be dependent upon a foreign country to build all of its military ships. Then, of course, England could have a real problem with the military, they could finish up with a military a large proportion being comprised of foriegn scots or with a better trained military on their northern borders than can mustered in england.

Then there is the nutty problem of the Ownership of the oil and gas fields and the price to paid for Electricity supplies to England by the Scots.

All of these exiting from unions are the behaviours of English fools, determined to wreck all around in fits of peek. It really is time that we, yes my birth certificate states that I am English, started to act like adults rather than stroppy school kids.

Disentagling from the EU may appear to be a cake walk in comparison to the breakup of our national union.

www.opendemocracy.net/en/opendemocracyuk/scotland-isnt-different-its-britain-thats-bizarre/?fbclid=IwAR3n_0IOWqRKsANhIi7BwVk5IALSIXEIuSQMJdoeWoXQ93Ow0B-fPdNLiGk

Quite a long read but gives a different perspective than I've seen elsewhere.

Trident is def good for the local economy in Scotland. Many live locally, renting family homes etc.

I do visit family close by. The scenery is stunning, Loch Lomond, Helensburgh plenty of people holiday. My family would not wish to leave the union.

Just read the document Grany23 pasted. It’s dated 2014 with some documents used in the document itself ranging back to 2012.

I did wonder as some German friends have paid for their children’s Uni fees to the tune of 75000 euros each. This post is up to date, they heaved a sigh of relief this September.