Sensible Discussion on Labour Leadership hopefuls MK 2

Urm you were rightly criticised over posting ill informed rubbish- stop playing the victim. And yes I agree GG she did start an argument in an empty room by posting this rubbish. Silly wasn’t she when all she had to do was check her ‘information’. Thanks for your support ?

For goodness sake can at least this thread stop with the crap, one upmanship/one upwomanship and what I am thinking of possible mysandry being on display.

The clue is in the title ' sensible discussion'.

Criticising aspects of gendered male behaviour is not misandry because it’s the behaviour that is criticised not tge sex of the person so behaving. If it’s a man as opposed to a woman that is exhibiting this behaviour then so be it.

And I would have thought a sensible discussion might accept the correcting of false information. Oh wait a minute, it was false information coming from the right wing - silly me. That’s all part of the Johnson/Trump playbook of lies and fake news. As you were. ?

I so agree.
I have little to contribute to this debate and follow it with detached interest as it has been very informative.
Suddenly has become rude and unpleasant.
A great shame.

High horses coming out of the stables now. Well there you go.

And I so agree that posting misinformation and refusing to acknowledge it is VERY rude and unpleasant. ?

Andrew Marr interviewed Rebecca Long Bailey this morning and I thought the question he asked re Long Bailey signing the Labour Campaign for Trans Rights ' 12 point plan calling for 'Expulsions ' of Labour Members who they deem as being transphobic was a fair one.

I thought the points he raised and his challenge as to Who, What, Where, When and How Labour Members would/could be ' Expelled ' in accordance to the Campaign wording did not garner a satisfactory response by Long Bailey.

The ' feminists' in the Labour Party have been very quiet over the Labour Campaign for Trans Rights, 12 point plan which is tantamount to ' NO Platforming ' them.

I need to catch up on the Andrew Marr interview but it's getting a very mixed response on social media.
He was right to ask those questions, will Lauta Pidcock be expelled for example?
To be honest I think the time has gone for being silent on this topic but I do have some sympathy for women in the Labour Party who dont dare speak out.

I am not on any social media such as Twitter or Facebook , only Gransnet but I can imagine what a bone of contention this has caused.

I bet when Long Bailey and Nandy signed up to it they thought it would be good for showing an inclusive nature but it has backfired on them spectacularly in the minds of some.

Why do you have some sympathy Galaxy? It’s too important to go along with. The only response as a member ( men and women) should be to speak out followed by #ExpelMe. Now is the time to speak out, send a clear message that this nonsense has to stop and empower KS to offer a more sensible way forward. Bykerping silent, Labour members, and especially women are complicit

I agree but women have lost their jobs, been threatened, etc. I am not open about this in my workplace so it would be hypocritical of me to not have some sympathy.

Ah Galaxy I misunderstood what you meant about women in the Labour Party not speaking out. I thought you meant not speaking out in their Labour Party roles eg Yvette Cooper. In fact, was your point really that some woman ( regardless of their party political views) are being punished and harassed for speaking out?

I dont think they can win really. I didnt vote for Laura Pidcock in the election because she wasnt brave enough, but when she did voice some concerns after the election it was a pile on and she was denounced as transphobic.

I still think that we're dealing with a very small but extraordinarily vocal minority. Statistically, what percentage of the population is trans? Does anyone know?

They absolutely need to be considered but not pandered to.

Just how crucial would their votes be to the leadership candidates?

Maizied

' Just how crucial would their votes be to the leadership candidates'
--

A fair question but if it is about percentages the votes 'possibly ' lost would be higher for Long Bailey and Nandy who have signed the ' Labour Campaign for Trans Rights ' 12 point plan calling for 'Expulsions ' of Labour Members who they deem as being transphobic in my opinion.

Starmer by not signing up to the ' full ' 12 point plan may well have shifted a few undecided into his camp.

But the future of the LP is not just about the here and now of this election but the ramifications if either RLB or LN win.

I think your analysis is spot on POGS

At a hustings LN has said that a man who raped a teenager 5 times and has since self id as a woman should be able to have her crimes recorded as committed by a woman and serve her time in a woman’s prison. I can’t decide if LN is sick or stupid or both but I know anyone who votes for either her of RLB should be ashamed of themselves. .

www.youtube.com/embed/oUon9j1zJ_E

Here’s the evidence - love the face to camera of the woman who asked the questions.

Interesting suziew I rarely look at links, but because of the subject matter ( which every woman should find worrying) I did do.
Lisa Nandy seems an honest if rather over earnest type, but obviously doesn't see the looming threat to women, at all.

One of the tweets after this video says. ‘she’s so woke she’s got insomnia’ Which would be funny if it weren’t so serious.Thanks lemon

I must remember that one!

I can’t just recall my source MaizieD but I did read this morning that it was 1% of the population:

I still think that we're dealing with a very small but extraordinarily vocal minority. Statistically, what percentage of the population is trans? Does anyone know?

www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p083ks5s

If the link works this is the Andrew Marr interview with Long Bailey today.

I found the part where Marr asks her about signing the Labour Campaign for Trans Rights very illuminating and she said she would change the 2010 Equality Law which allows exclusions from women-only spaces.