Do you beieve Hancock or NHS staff?

Not at all Maizie

NHS staff are human too and scared like everyone else.

I am criticising the reports studies and articles for not asking specific enough questions.
PPE is a broad church. And it IS subjective at the moment. You dont actually get useful answers from asking in such non specific ways.

Tasks which have been risk assessed, in the past, have now become much more dangerous because of covid.
So it seems obvious that more PPE is needed so that staff have e.g. masks where previously no masks were used.

The Government knew what needed doing back in 2016 and chose to do nothing.

Along with the rest of the world

And in reality it was 2006 that researchers discovered problems at Chinese wet markets with coronvirus passing from animals to humans but nobody paid attention to that either

Excellent points raised by notanan as well

Tasks which have been risk assessed, in the past, have now become much more dangerous because of covid.

Everywhere has been re-risk assessed.

PPE has its own risks. They have to be balanced against the risk of the task/area. Feeling safer doesnt mean you are!

Aprons and gloves are standard PPE when you perform any task for any patient - dressings, injections etc. Most areas in NHS centres will already have these as they have been in use for years.
Patients with infections like Covid-19 exude the virus from nose, mouth, eyes, skin etc so these PPEs are not adequate and masks and gowns also become necessary. When you perform invasive procedures on seriously ill patients full PPE is required as there is a higher risk of contamination from blood, sputum, faeces, urine etc. There is also a risk to staff on removal of PPE so training has to be given on usage and disposal. Despite these PPEs staff are still at risk of becoming infected.
NHS staff are correct and the minister had a b****y cheek saying what he did and should be prepared to do the work himself if that is what he thinks. At the very least apologise!
SiL is in the police and all they had was watered down handwash for a few weeks. Now have 1 mask each and if they use it (single use) they need to go back to the station to order another. Ministers stand up on podiums and make announcements and have not the slightest clue what is happening in towns, streets, practices, local hospitals, police stations, tubes, buses etc etc etc

An important part of how PPE works is that it is removed and not worn everywhere.

You simply could not run around a bay of patients in ITU style PPE. You would SPREAD more infections than gloves and apron, and you would probably dehydrate and feint

It is being reported that the U.K. is set to have the most deaths in Europe.

The deaths over this week can be traced back to the Cheltenham, Twickenham, Liverpool and a pop concert, together with Johnson insistence up until very shortly before lockdown that the risk in the U.K. was low. The decision was made on the Friday to lock down, but Johnson continued to prevaricate until the Monday.

This virus was never treated with the respect it deserved and insufficient preparation was carried out.

PPE is undoubtedly in short supply, absolutely no question. Hancock et al are playing the game of denial, but sensible people will believe the staff.

Operative Cygnet was a UK not an international exercise. It's irrelevant how the rest of the world did or didn't prepare. Our government knew what needed doing to prepare for this sort of situation and chose to do nothing. There are no excuses for knowing what needed to be done and failing to do it.

I've just been speaking to my neighbour, who is working on a ward where the covid patients are, and she has said they have ppe.

My neighbour both nurses, say they are in short supply.

It's irrelevant how the rest of the world did or didn't prepare.

It's not irrelevant at all.

Had the rest of the world followed similar guidance there would have been no spread

Had the rest of the world paid attention to research in 2006 it might have been stopped

It's global

Our first cases stemmed from a chap who'd been to Italy

It's a worldwide problem and we need to accept this

Some interesting comments from Bill Gates and others who predicted a pandemic. Some more substantial than others

www.businessinsider.com/people-who-seemingly-predicted-the-coronavirus-pandemic-2020-3?r=US&IR=T

Ah blame the foreigners! But I don't see how that impacts on what Matt Hancock says.

No our first case stemmed from a doctor who had been to Wuhan and returned via Italy. I know because he lives near me.

Or Priti Patel Home Secretary Priti Patel yesterday apologised to NHS workers over PPE at the Government’s daily press briefing, saying: “I am sorry if people feel there have been failings.
“It is inevitable that the demand and pressures on PPE and the demand for PPE are going to be exponential, they are going to be incredibly high.”
Is she just admitting the staff are right and there isn't enough PPE?

This pandemic will seem as nothing unless we tackle the issue of giving farmed animals antibiotics.

DIL is a nurse at a large hospital and they have had PPE for weeks and weeks.
notatanan makes really good and valid points about the wearing of it, but if you just want to make ignorant remarks without any understanding then go ahead ( oh, you already have.)

ANYONE saying that the NHS don't know what they're talking about should be ashamed. They are working for peanuts and putting their lives on the line. We should listen to what they say.

Not some bloke on a podium, who isn't even the (useless) PM, who is only trying to deflect blame.

GREAT that some hospitals have it. Not all do. We should NOT stop complaining until they all do.

We may well run out of PPE. We damn near ran out of medical gasses already.
We have not run out of PPE yet
Doesnt mean we won't

There are people who disagree with senior clinical staff about which task requires what type of PPE.
That does not = the hospitals not having it.
Not yet.

Oopsminty If the UK government was aware that the rest of the world wasn't taking adequate precautions, it should have done even more to protect its own citizens. The UK has no control over Chinese markets, but it does have control over - and is responsible for - what happens in the UK. It would have been ridiculous to have huge stockpiles of appropriate PPE, but it should have known how to procure and distribute it quickly and efficiently in an emergency. Unfortunately, cutting the numbers of civil servants meant this kind of contingency planning was often overlooked. Many of them were redeployed to Brexit over the last couple of years anyway.

That = community nursing and care staff not having the PPE that’s needed. Remember that not everyone who is treated for or who dies of covid does so in hospital.

They are certainly not paid ‘peanuts! Our DIL earns a good salary as a nurse, ditto SIL as a policeman.They could always be paid more, like any public workers, but that’s another matter.

Brexit was the issue as to why the governments eye was off the virus ball in the first place

Ah blame the foreigners!

My word. What an ignorant comment!

If you're finding this hard to understand I'll try to explain.

Yes. We were unprepared.

As was the whole world.

Despite being told this was a possibility, governments around the world did nothing

Which means that it spread all over the world

I am not attributing blame to any country

But just to carp about our lack of action is quite ridiculous

Surely it would have been better had the virus never existed in the first place

Which might have happened had someone acted on the researchers findings in 2006

But sadly it didn't happen

And now I have 2 close family members working on the frontline

One is on the end of life ward

People have no idea what's going on in hospitals at the moment.

And as I worry for my son I am tired of reading endless blame being pointed at the government and people making political points

Sickens me actually