Lazy, lazy Boris

Well Boris paid the price for his stupidity didn't he ? That action he took in shaking hands certainly didn't mean that everyone else had to do the same ? Which is why I said that we're responsible for our own health regardless of what others do.

We wouldn't put our hand in a fire because someone else did would we ? As for those with dementia, they usually have someone with them who are alert to these things happening.

It's also down to management if there are unsafe working environments, not Boris----he doesn't know what goes on in the lives of 65 million people @ growstuff.

EllanVannin

I know as well as anyone else that there's no easy answer considering that many without underlying health problems also died, but at the same time I don't see the sense or logic in blaming one person for the ills in this country either when each adult is responsible for their own health.

How can they be responsible for their own health if they have dementia or are forced to work in an unsafe environment? And when we had a leader who boasted about shaking hands with Covid-19 patients and taking it on the chin? What kind of message did that give to people who didn't have that much information?

Exactly, Ellianne. Which is why I object to Boris being blamed and also branded lazy. He's been the messenger and you don't shoot them !

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Together many voices can make a difference a lone voice simply ignored.

But wasn't Boris simply acting on the information given to him by the medics and the scientists? Certainly at the start of lockdown.

I know as well as anyone else that there's no easy answer considering that many without underlying health problems also died, but at the same time I don't see the sense or logic in blaming one person for the ills in this country either when each adult is responsible for their own health.

I asked that question to see how many would blame Boris, MaizieD.

So why/how did so many die of the virus ?

Good heavens, EV. You're an ex-nurse. You've seen everything that has been done or not done. You've been able to access information about other countries' handling of the pandemic, current research, updates to research, the informed opinion of virologists, epidemiologists, public health experts etc. etc. yet you still ask ridiculously trite questions? There's reams an reams of information available on the internet. Can you not put two and two together and draw a conclusion instead of asking us?

I think you may be exaggerating a little EV with your statements that nothing has improved medically since the late 1950s, cancer survival rates would contradict that for a start off, plus we know so much more about the dangers of smoking, obesity etc., and I do not share your enthusiasm for the good old days of medicine.

EllanVannin

If Boris is relying on medics for his speeches then I feel damn sorry for him. They seem to change like the wind.

Nobody knows anything about this virus--how it works, it's reaction in different members of the public, who dies and who doesn't.

I don't understand you.

Scientists and medics have a very good idea how the virus works - and have done for some time. The statistics are very clear about who is at highest risk of dying.

There's still much to learn, for example about immunity and, of course, how to prevent transmission. However, it's simply not true to claim that "nobody knows anything about this virus".

So many died because the country was not prepared despite scientific reports over previous decades. Also too many died, compared with say Germany, due of the lack of laboratories.

So why/how did so many die of the virus ?

Sorry, EV, I meant "we" as a country, and the decision makers. Of course the public needs to use common sense. The amazing community spirit displayed will be remembered for a long while to come and I dare say would surface again if necessary. Government should not be allowed to forget either. Those in power, the scientists, and the decision makers now all have the knowledge to bring about massive change in the NHS and to make the necessary funding available.

EllanVannin

If Boris is relying on medics for his speeches then I feel damn sorry for him. They seem to change like the wind.

Nobody knows anything about this virus--how it works, it's reaction in different members of the public, who dies and who doesn't.

I give up on this conversation. You are no longer making any sense.

EllanVannin

It makes me feel very sad to think that things haven't moved much further within the NHS. It's only those who've enjoyed years of experience that I would ever trust as I have very little confidence in GP's generally who have people's lives in their hands. What's gone wrong ?

All those cancer survivors won’t agree

All those with heart issues won’t agree

If Boris is relying on medics for his speeches then I feel damn sorry for him. They seem to change like the wind.

Nobody knows anything about this virus--how it works, it's reaction in different members of the public, who dies and who doesn't.

Oh dear nothing. It's how things were and still are.

Finally I would work hard to be on top of my brief, that I sounded confident and truthful in my speeches and answers to questions. That I never ever lied over what is actually happening, and worked hard to build trust and confidence.

It makes me feel very sad to think that things haven't moved much further within the NHS. It's only those who've enjoyed years of experience that I would ever trust as I have very little confidence in GP's generally who have people's lives in their hands. What's gone wrong ?

EllanVannin

Common sense counts for a lot but unfortunately it's in short supply for many. Cleanliness too counts for a lot but some people still smell which denotes a lack of hygiene.

I nursed patients through Asian flu in 1957 and remember having 2 vaccinations within 2/3 weeks of each other at the time but I don't remember any notices given out about what to do and nobody was in isolation. People still died from it including young adults.

Test and trace is as good as useless unless it's a blood test for antibodies. We haven't come that far in the NHS since the 1950's !

Oh dear

The other thing I would do apart from ditching Cummings is to make sure that I have the best person possible as Health Secretary. I would also recognise that the situation is unique and enormous, so I would give the Health Secretary a strong team of MPs with the power to direct decisions etc.

I would separate social care and give that Minister the task of formulating a plan for the future which can be brought to cabinet and thrashed out with funding guaranteed.

Common sense counts for a lot but unfortunately it's in short supply for many. Cleanliness too counts for a lot but some people still smell which denotes a lack of hygiene.

I nursed patients through Asian flu in 1957 and remember having 2 vaccinations within 2/3 weeks of each other at the time but I don't remember any notices given out about what to do and nobody was in isolation. People still died from it including young adults.

Test and trace is as good as useless unless it's a blood test for antibodies. We haven't come that far in the NHS since the 1950's !

EllanVannin

Ellianne, in other words it's down to the common sense of the public who now know how many have died so hopefully will have been alerted to this, but sadly many members of the public haven't got the sense they were born with.
It's not rocket science to follow the prevention instructions.

Bit simplistic

I suspect that one of the biggest problems with this government is King Cummings who is acting as an unelected dictator which has the stultifying effect of preventing various ministers from making decisions and acting on them (assuming they are capable).

No one person can possibly oversee every decision made but it seems that is exactly what King Cummings is trying to do as we saw how nothing was done whilst Cummings was running around the country on holiday.

This has in effect a weakening affect on good decision making. I n good government, these things are thrashed out in cabinet but with Cummings having the final say, we are not getting the government we expect or deserve.

Ellianne, in other words it's down to the common sense of the public who now know how many have died so hopefully will have been alerted to this, but sadly many members of the public haven't got the sense they were born with.
It's not rocket science to follow the prevention instructions.