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NHS-were we clapping or waving goodbye?

(66 Posts)
trisher Tue 21-Jul-20 09:36:37

Last night Tory MPs voted down an amendment which would have protected the NHS from more privatisation by keeping it out of any Trade Deals. So all the assurances about how much they appreciate it were just hot air. The Covid crisis may well be the last act of a dying organisation.
Proposed by Catherine Lucas, this was the amendment.
New Clause 17
In addition to protecting the NHS from foreign control, the amendment also contained numerous other measures to protect the NHS, including:

Ensuring the ability to provide a “comprehensive and publicly funded health service free at the point of delivery” was not compromised by any future trade deal
Protecting hard-working NHS staff from having their wages or rights slashed by any future trade deal
Protecting the quality and safety of health and care services
Regulating the control and pricing of medicines
Protecting patient data from being sold off
Protecting the NHS from so-called investor-state dispute settlements (ISDS) – clauses which allow foreign investors to sue national governments for any measures which harm their profits.

Alexa Tue 21-Jul-20 09:44:55

Privatisation will kill the NHS if the Tories are permitted to go on privatising.

Alexa Tue 21-Jul-20 09:46:20

The Tories contract with private concerns and by doing so, the Tories naturally choose the cheapest option, after the manner of Basil Fawlty and the Builders,

Greeneyedgirl Tue 21-Jul-20 09:54:03

Privatising the so called Social Care sector hasn’t worked and yet onward and downward, in pursuit of profit we go.

I don’t believe it is possible to run a comprehensive health care service, on a private, profit based system. We are clearly going down the US route, where if you are poor, or your insurance runs out hard luck!

Insurance companies must be overjoyed.

Charleygirl5 Tue 21-Jul-20 10:32:28

Very worrying especially as many of us are uninsurable.

Whitewavemark2 Tue 21-Jul-20 10:35:28

I asked for a quote for both of us. 😄😄😄😄😄😄

Lucca Tue 21-Jul-20 11:32:55

I’d be interested to hear from grands who think privatising nhs is a good idea ?

trisher Tue 21-Jul-20 11:45:26

Mm I was wondering where are the caring Conservatives to explain this to me?

maddyone Tue 21-Jul-20 11:46:33

I shouldn’t have thought anyone thinks privatising the NHS is a good idea.

Luckygirl Tue 21-Jul-20 11:48:04

It is so sad - they just do not get the meaning of the word "service" and never did - profit is the God.

trisher Tue 21-Jul-20 11:48:05

Well Tory MPs obviously think it's OK.

biba70 Tue 21-Jul-20 11:50:12

Trump pulls the strings- we have become his puppet. He wants the NHS part of the Deal- he wants us to accept terrible standards for meat, bio-safety and husbandry, it does not want USA car industry to be part of Deal. And we have NO choice- yes Master, whatever you say Master.

Because we wont have China on board, and not Russia either- and we will have got rid of the EU - so what else is there but to agree to Trumps every whim- at whatever cost.

ladymuck Tue 21-Jul-20 12:01:50

We need to encourage more people to join the health sector. Forget cheap foreign labour, we have plenty of our own people available. We just need to make the profession more attractive to them. Higher wages, better working conditions will act as an incentive.
The government should be concentrating on that instead of looking for ways to save money.

GillT57 Tue 21-Jul-20 12:07:21

Bit quiet this morning......where are all the Johsnon supporters? All those who mocked and sneered at Corbyn when he warned this was going to happen? All conveniently slipped out at the same time as the announcement of public sector pay rises and the same day as the release of the Russia report. Obviously the photos of Johnson and his offspring didn;t work as a distraction

silverlining48 Tue 21-Jul-20 12:26:43

We have been waving goodbye for some time, bit by bit is being hived off, has been for years. When will the tories realise that not everything is about profit and market forces and whatever else they believe in.
This is a service, a health service which is being starved until they can say it’s not working and we need a new (American) system. God or whoever else, help us.

westendgirl Tue 21-Jul-20 12:35:23

This was feared but expected. What are they thinking of?

Ideas please .

MaizieD Tue 21-Jul-20 12:36:36

No pay rise for NHS workers or junior doctors, either.

NO pay rises for those because nurses had a three year pay deal, which ends next April, and junior doctors have a 4 year deal agreed last year. Which seems 'sort of' fair, but as the rises for other public sector workers are being trumpeted as 'above inflation', how do the existing 'deals' compare?

No new money for these 'generous' pay rises though, it has to come out of, already cut to the bone, existing budgets.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-53478404

MaizieD Tue 21-Jul-20 12:40:21

What are they thinking of?

Complete destruction of our public services, I think. Look at the USA and despair.

It's all part of Cummings 'throw it all up in the air and see where it lands' plan.

growstuff Tue 21-Jul-20 12:46:50

MaizieD

No pay rise for NHS workers or junior doctors, either.

NO pay rises for those because nurses had a three year pay deal, which ends next April, and junior doctors have a 4 year deal agreed last year. Which seems 'sort of' fair, but as the rises for other public sector workers are being trumpeted as 'above inflation', how do the existing 'deals' compare?

No new money for these 'generous' pay rises though, it has to come out of, already cut to the bone, existing budgets.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-53478404

There's your reason. Teachers and doctors have separate pay review bodies, which have reported. The government has accepted the recommendations, but there's no "new money".

Hetty58 Tue 21-Jul-20 12:47:48

I wouldn't expect anything else from the Tories. Why people continue to vote for them (against their own interests) I will never know!

growstuff Tue 21-Jul-20 12:48:11

ladymuck

We need to encourage more people to join the health sector. Forget cheap foreign labour, we have plenty of our own people available. We just need to make the profession more attractive to them. Higher wages, better working conditions will act as an incentive.
The government should be concentrating on that instead of looking for ways to save money.

To do that, the country needs to make a massive investment in training. So where's the money to do that?

trisher Tue 21-Jul-20 13:30:55

I can' remember how many times I have been told on GN that the Conservatives really do care about the NHS and that I was an obsessed leftie not trusting them to look after it. Well I may be obsessed but that doesn't make me wrong.

GillT57 Tue 21-Jul-20 13:40:48

Yes well trisher we 'obsessed lefties' are talking to ourselves this morning I fear, although I expect a few Tory voters will be along later to tell us that if only the NHS didn't treat drunks/drug addicts/illegal immigrants/health tourists everything would be fine. It was also pointed out this morning that the much hailed public sector payrise does not in fact cover the below inflation pay rises of the past few years, and that many staff are, in real terms, worse off than they were 8 years ago. But hey, let's not let a few facts get in the way of governing eh?

Lucca Tue 21-Jul-20 13:42:22

And answer came there none.....

MayBee70 Tue 21-Jul-20 13:44:41

They used the NHS to win the EU referendum. I don’t know how some of them can sleep at night. Then again some have been given knighthoods haven’t they (eg Gisella Stuart).