Political Correctness or just ridiculous

Elegran I don't think you understand that that just isn't relevant, it's not relevant because it's not related. It's not relevant and it doesn't upset people. It's an extraordinary leap and it's an uncomfortable one for some reading it.

A lady wanted to buy a bra that matches her skin tone, she didn't like it was called "tobacco" and she felt that was a negative name choice for a colour compared to other bras with positive name choices.

I wouldn't want to buy a bra called "tobacco", it's the same as I wouldn't want to buy a bra named "vomit yellow". But that is not the actual point here.

The point is that, someone gave an item that matches skin tone a negative name. If it was a sofa, no one would buy it to match skin tone but many would be put off by the name. Foundation would also be problematic called tobacco... Its bad marketing... Its a poor choice that you would have to wonder why, the person naming it, for women who often like pretty things, would make it

The fact that so few see how they are contributing to racism and In fact think they are arguing against it is wholly disheartening.

hearts might be in the right place, but words and attitudes are not.

I now fully understand why so many here do not see the UK as having race issues.

Has no one come back to give you an answer to your query yet Elegran? Shame that because it was a fair and valid comparison and most certainly not just to be dismissed as bad taste or was in very poor taste indeed.

Your point is valid and well made Elegran. Gas, oven and chamber are all associated with the holocaust but their use today as far as I'm aware, has never been associated with anti semitism.

Jewish people are traumatised, but not by having a gas cooker. They are traumatised by what happened to their relatives, and several Jewish people have said to me (including our dear friends who live in America) that they will never set foot in Germany.

Message deleted by Gransnet. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

After slavery ended ( in the US it was after their civil war) tobacco continued to be picked, by free men and women.
As did cotton and sugar come to that.
I think the complainant just didn’t like the connotations with smoking.She obviously didn’t realise that tobacco as a name for colour has been around for a long time.

An excellent contribution to this discussion Oldwoman.

I can see why that would have been an overpowering experience Callistemon. 'Poison' is a very heady scent and I only use it in the evening and sparingly.

when it more than likely they were rounded up and sold on by other black tribes not just more than likely quizqueen it did happen.

I remember watching an episode of 'Who do you think you are' when Ainsley Harriet discovered one of his ancestors, GGGF I think, was a slave trader.

If we're not careful EllanVinnan we'll end up with a society where everyone is equal but some are more equal than others.

Communism===discouraging religion, turning against the government, no faith in leaders and dividing them into hostile groups---------sound familiar ?
Controlled healthcare, ie waiting times too long. Poverty level is unacceptably high, but nobody cares so long as they can be controlled by what they already receive. Debt, which we haven't yet seen in its entirety but will call for increased taxes to ensure that more poverty is produced.

This is what's happening in this country.

This is what happens when you have Russian oligarchs influencing this country and funding the government.

As someone who has been on the receiving end of true racist comments I agree this complaint trivialises a serious issue.

It reminds me of a cartoon I saw:
a man talking to a small child "What do you say to get what you want"
Child: "I'm offended".

EllanVannin

I think you mean individual liberty
Freedom of speech is the US I think.

We have:

Democracy
Individual Liberty
Tolerance
Respect

In order to have those values, all of us must have them. So that way no one can use their individual liberty to be racist, homophobic, sexist or any of those awful things that generally effect most of us negatively in one shape or form.

I expect you could petition the government otherwise but I doubt they will change it. Imagine if people were at liberty to verbally abuse other races, other sexualities or their wives and daughters/husbands and sons over things they cannot control. People do not choose the colour of their skin, their sexuality or their gender.

The entire country would be an awful place for prettyuch everyone.

The first slaves were taken by the ancients Sumerians and Babylonians many centuries BC and could have been black or white. Why is it continually pointed out to us that all slaves were black and taken by the white British or those who colonised America, when it more than likely they were rounded up and sold on by other black tribes.

People need to look at the truth of history. If it hadn't been for white people, then there may still be black slaves in the west. They certainly still do exist in parts of Africa and that's nothing to do with white people but there is no condemnation there by black people. No, it is only white people who are bad. Also, how many white soldiers died in the American Civil War to free them!

Freedom of speech has all but gone. Democracy will soon be a thing of the past I fear.

Shoe polish used to be very racist.

Well it's true that you learn something new every day

I had no idea that bras had coloured names.

I go to Marks. Pick up a bra. No clue what colour M&S has given it

Ridiculous nonsense. Next thing the government will be legislating against free speech. Heaven help us. Minorities are ruling over common sense.

Callistermon I think black people and their allies do not believe these issues trivial at all. Because the desire to fight for equality and the need to respect the feelings of others is paramount to the movement. All issues and all feelings.

If you feel strongly though I would suggest you take it up with the media and say something like:

"Why would you broadcast this issue that has been quickly dealt with, in a way that makes it look trivial when you know it will enrage certain readers? Instead why not address ALL the very real issues people face rather than only report what you know some will happily use to dismiss racism as an issue at all.

Slaves harvested sugar. We have white sugar and brown sugar. Should we change their names?

No, Smileless and Callistemon are right. It trivialises the issue.

This trivialises a very serious issue

It does indeed Smileless

It is a worrying trend too, that such irrelevance will stop people taking an important campaign seriously, will antagonise many when support is needed for some extremely serious issues.

Tobacco as a colour - well tobacco when growing is green, when dried and cured the shade varies anyway.

Smileless
I agree with your post of 10.13. There is indeed a danger that the serious issue of racism will be trivialised by complaining about such things as the name of the colour of underwear.

For anyone who would like to educate themselves on what actually happened, the correct words and why we shouldn't ever use such an awful situation to make a point.

It's a history lesson and an opportunity for personal growth.

Many times in my life I have met someone who has taken the time and explained why what I said was not OK, at first I didn't like to listen, later I realised it was beneficial to me as a human being.

Personally I would be horrified if I was the same person I was a year ago. Personal growth is beautiful and I sincerely respect anyone on that journey.

auschwitz.org/en/history/auschwitz-and-shoah/the-extermination-procedure-in-the-gas-chambers

Smileless2012

There still is Callistemon and it's one of my favourites.

Oh Smileless!!
I used to lift share with someone who wore either Poison or Opium and I don't like heavy perfumes, especially first thing in the morning rush hour!!

However, it was just the perfume I disliked, I still like her ?

Granny23

But that is the point Chewbacca. Words that were a small insult in my mind, where the worst possible condemnation to my friends - as bad as if I had called them "b*st*rds.

No, Granny23 rest assured that you were right and your sister was wrong.

Ill bred means rude, ill-mannered and badly brought up whether the child was illegitimate or born in wedlock (curiously old-fashioned term now).
They may have been illegitimate but well brought up but were ganging up on you.
Sometimes we carry misconceptions all our lives because of what someone told us as an impressionable child.

There still is Callistemon and it's one of my favourites.