Get back to the office! But why?

Bluebelle, that's why it needs to be up to individuals and employers. I have spent the last 6 months dealing with distressed families from my home so I dont need to glaze over as you charmingly put it, it's my reality.

Galaxy

Bluebelle, that's why it needs to be up to individuals and employers. I have spent the last 6 months dealing with distressed families from my home so I dont need to glaze over as you charmingly put it, it's my reality.

As does my nephew. He seems to be managing very well, but again he does have the option of going to the office. Always has had.

Still working from home.

And if people want to return to the office why on earth would I care, what works for some doesnt work for others. Why on earth therefore should people care if I or others can do part of our work from home.

Posters keep on saying 'return to work' but it's bullsh*t. They are talking about people who are working. That's what WFH stands for; working from home.

Very saddened by a supposedly staunch socialist having such contempt for the integrity of people working from home that they are accused of skiving when they should be available.

I'm sure most aren't skiving but I don't want to be hearing a dog barking in the background when I'm trying to talk to a bank.

Also DS has to contact IT support who are now home based. He often hears small children shouting and babies crying in the background. It's really not ideal. And it is taking ages to get through on the phone.

If existing staff can't/won't get back to the office some of them will lose their jobs to people that can. Let's face it there are going to be lots of unemployed to choose from.

MaizieD

Posters keep on saying 'return to work' but it's bullsh*t. They are talking about people who are working. That's what WFH stands for; working from home.

Very saddened by a supposedly staunch socialist having such contempt for the integrity of people working from home that they are accused of skiving when they should be available.

My thoughts exactly.

It will be interesting to see how it works wont it, I think those background noises make people seem more human (which they are) I on the other hand wouldn't use companies who forced their employees back to the office.
I certainly wouldn't use a company who threatened them with the current unemployment situation.

There’s a very interesting article in the Financial Times today supporting continued WFH for those who wish to. It’s called Goodbye to the Pret Economy though it’s behind a paywall.

It suggest that companies like Pret could reinvent themselves by getting some vans and selling coffee and sandwiches to people working at home, a la ice cream van. Interestingly, it commented that there are more branches of Pret on Borough High St than in the whole of Wales.

Exactly SueDonim the companies that will survive are the ones that can innovate and think of different ways of working rather than trying to return to how things were before.

(on a very small anecdotal level, our nearby florist began to sell greengrocery when non essential shops were told not to open, they are surviving)

When I worked in an office some of the staff spent a lot of the time chatting to colleagues which was irritating to those trying to concentrate on their work. I'm not talking about a 5 minute chat which was acceptable but more like 20 minutes several times during the day.
Those who have talked about people wfh skiving need to know that a lot of skiving is done in offices.

I work from home and have two dogs who are in the same room as me. They are the kind who follow one around from room to room. Occasionally they will bark if they see something out of the ordinary through the window. If I'm on the phone i ask the person to excuse me and I throw them out. it's no different really to having a coughing or sneezing fit. You still have to excuse yourself until it's over.

SueDonim

There’s a very interesting article in the Financial Times today supporting continued WFH for those who wish to. It’s called Goodbye to the Pret Economy though it’s behind a paywall.

It suggest that companies like Pret could reinvent themselves by getting some vans and selling coffee and sandwiches to people working at home, a la ice cream van. Interestingly, it commented that there are more branches of Pret on Borough High St than in the whole of Wales.

That's an interesting idea. If you watch American tv series like Suits, there are always scenes with workers getting their morning coffee or their lunch from a food truck.

Most workplaces have tea/coffee making facilities. Why don't they take their own sandwiches? I did that for all the years I commuted to an office. It's no big deal. I know some folk can't cook but is there anyone incapable of making a sandwich?

varian

Most workplaces have tea/coffee making facilities. Why don't they take their own sandwiches? I did that for all the years I commuted to an office. It's no big deal. I know some folk can't cook but is there anyone incapable of making a sandwich?

In the same way that people can do their own cleaning, do their own decorating, do their own gardening, walk their own dog, mind their own children, make their own clothes, cook their own fish and chips, (probably) cut their own hair and tinker with their own car. .
On the other hand, if you are one of the millions or people whose job encompasses any of the above I expect you depend on the fact that many have neither the time, talent or inclination to do them.
I thought this thread was about the economy and anybody who cannot see the complex but apparently fragile interdependence of all its component parts has missed the point completely.

MawB2

varian

Most workplaces have tea/coffee making facilities. Why don't they take their own sandwiches? I did that for all the years I commuted to an office. It's no big deal. I know some folk can't cook but is there anyone incapable of making a sandwich?

In the same way that people can do their own cleaning, do their own decorating, do their own gardening, walk their own dog, mind their own children, make their own clothes, cook their own fish and chips, (probably) cut their own hair and tinker with their own car. .
On the other hand, if you are one of the millions or people whose job encompasses any of the above I expect you depend on the fact that many have neither the time, talent or inclination to do them.
I thought this thread was about the economy and anybody who cannot see the complex but apparently fragile interdependence of all its component parts has missed the point completely.

I think that the point that is being missed is that work is proving more productive by those working from home.

That individuals will make rational decisions relating to their risk.

They have benefited economically from working at home.

Most have the choice whether to continue at home or go to the office.

The Pret economy is one of low pay and poor conditions. Why support such companies?

Those being supported at home by excellent employers whose trust in their staff is ensuring ever more loyal and hard working staff.

That is the point.

Whitewavemark2 quote [I think that the point that is being missed is that work is proving more productive by those working from home.] End quote.

Have you any evidence to support the above statement???????

Whitewavemark2 Quote [Most have the choice whether to continue at home or go to the office.] End Quote.

The vast majority of furloughed workers have not even been working at home because their employer's businesses have been completely closed down. Those workers are gradually being informed to return to their place of employment as their employer's companies gradually return to what they hope will be pre-Covid levels.

Those who have been working from home are either being allowed to continue if they so wish, or if they work as part of a team being told to return to the office.

Whitewavemark2 Quote [The Pret economy is one of low pay and poor conditions. Why support such companies?] End Quote.

To those that work in Pret and all other high street food and coffee outlets, it is their employment supporting them and often their families. To just disparagingly disregard those workers and their employers is nothing short of disgusting.

And the above comes from someone who states they are socialist in their views. Just throw them out of work they will somehow manage.

Is that Starmer's Labour Party????

Whitewavemark2
Did you have a memory lapse when referencing the Pret economy and forget that your a socialist. What else would you suggest these people do, sign on ?

If I were a commuter, I'd rather donate my travel-to-work costs directly to the benefit of Pret workers. The government couldn't care less about sandwich bar workers. It does, however, care about the income of the landlords of prime site office blocks. Personally, I'd rather safeguard my health, save hours a day on commuting and spend my money locally rather than be guilt-tripped into saving the investments of foreign oligarchs.

What's non-socialist about that?

Some people who used to make sandwiches or coffee may have to retrain. There was a time when horse drawn carriage drivers had to retrain and they did.

No employer would want to risk facing a class action if he/she were to try to force employers back to working in an office, unless a safe working environment could be provided.

Employers are the best judges as to whether employees have been working efficiently at home and the pandemic might have forced some changes in attitudes towards a more flexible way of working.

If you go to work in an an office it is either because the work cannot be done at home, or because you prefer to work in the office or because your employer, in spite of the fact you can do the job from home, insists that you work in the office, in which case you need to get yourself a better trades union representative.

varian

If you go to work in an an office it is either because the work cannot be done at home, or because you prefer to work in the office or because your employer, in spite of the fact you can do the job from home, insists that you work in the office, in which case you need to get yourself a better trades union representative.

I thought you believed that trades unions and all that were members and supporters of them were fifty years out of date varian.

Now you are stating that workers should be members of trades unions. I must say that is a bit rich coming from a member of the LibDem Party whose new leader assisted the Tory Party in attempting to destroy those trade unions from 2010 until 2015.

growstuff

No employer would want to risk facing a class action if he/she were to try to force employers back to working in an office, unless a safe working environment could be provided.

Employers are the best judges as to whether employees have been working efficiently at home and the pandemic might have forced some changes in attitudes towards a more flexible way of working.

As long as any employer has carried out all that is reasonably possible to ensure the safety of the workforce as defined under the Health & Safety at Work Act there is little or no chance that legal action of any kind would be successful.

In a huge number of instances, it has been the insurers that have pushed employers to bring about the highest possible standards of protection against Covid-19 infection under the guidance of the Health & Safety Executive and consultancy Safety companies.

varian

Some people who used to make sandwiches or coffee may have to retrain. There was a time when horse drawn carriage drivers had to retrain and they did.

And do you think that retraining and finding new jobs will be at all possible with Britain having three or possibly four million unemployed at best in the coming year?

What the government is trying to achieve I believe is to return the economy back to as near normal as possible prior to lockdown and then let changes inline with Covid-19 and Brexit slowly come into being.

The General Secretary of the TUC stated general agreement with the above policy in her interviews with the media today. It would seem that this Conservative government are being far more socialist than those who claim to be such on this forum.

There you go again misquoting other posters Grandad

I have never suggested that trades unions were fifty years out of date. You made that up. I have said that trades unions are a good thing, and the many members of the Association of Liberal Democrat Trade Unionists would agree.

It was Labour Party supporter Polly Toynbee who referred to some trades unionists as "dinosaurs", not me.