BAME - Let's stop using it

EllanVannin

Why single people out, we're all the same aren't we ? Regardless.

Oh come on, really? Do you mean on the mortuary table?

Chewbacca

^Would you have asked her if she "looked" white?^

I might have done if she'd had an accent that I couldn't quite place and circumstances and situation allowed.

I have an accent you probably couldn't place. If that led you to asking me where I was from the very least you'd get is a telling off.

eazybee

It would be considerably easier if some people weren't so quick to take offence, usually on other people's behalf, when no offence is intended.

Oh but offence is often intended

I have an accent you probably couldn't place. If that led you to asking me where I was from the very least you'd get is a telling off.

And you'd get one right back for being a rude and unfriendly old baggage!

eazybee

It would be considerably easier if some people weren't so quick to take offence, usually on other people's behalf, when no offence is intended.

I guess that'll be me then? Or am I just taking offence too quick?

I'll stand up for people who aren't here and I'll point out when people are being thoughtless, yes, that's going to keep on happening. I guess you'll just have to live with it.

Anyway, BAME....

Chewbacca

^I have an accent you probably couldn't place. If that led you to asking me where I was from the^ very least you'd get is a telling off.

And you'd get one right back for being a rude and unfriendly old baggage!

Then I'd tell you its none of your business, you nosy old.....

Let's not have a fight on Gransnet

A sports pundit lost his job with sky because during a commentary he referred to a footballer as “ half caste”.
This was a polite term and one that I was brought up with.
It is now unacceptable.

I listened to an article on radio 4 some months ago where a gentleman of mixed race said he felt that was a derogatory term, he suggested combined heritage.
So it goes on.
It’s getting to the stage where I really no longer know what may offend.
My SIL is mixed race, he doesn’t really care.
Our granddaughter says that her daddy is brown, she’s the only one in her little school with a brown daddy and she is so proud.

On my various outings during lockdowns of various kinds I’ve struck up numerous conversations with random strangers . Never have I asked them

Where they come from
How much their income is
How often they have sex

We seem to have found plenty of things to talk about regardless

I think if I meet someone new I’ll just smile and say ‘lovely weather we’re having’. It’s safer.

Two of my friends don't like it either, the one prefers to be black, the other South East Asian and I don't know why it is so difficult to categorise them as such if that's what they want. Specific issues affect specific groups too and that's what should be concentrated on. Lumping people together doesn't work.

Alegrias1

Chewbacca

Would you have asked her if she "looked" white?

I might have done if she'd had an accent that I couldn't quite place and circumstances and situation allowed.

I have an accent you probably couldn't place. If that led you to asking me where I was from the very least you'd get is a telling off.

But I have had a very interesting conversation with someone whose accent I thought was Irish, but who turned out to have lived most of his life in the Western Isles. We discussed the similarities and differences, and how accents changed gradually across the country from East to West and North to South, and how successive waves of immigration to and from Ireland had affected intonation and ways of speech. If I hadn't asked where his accent came from, we would both have missed out.

Your unplaceable one sounds interesting, Alegrias. A pity you are so prickly about it.

It's Doric Elegran. Not prickly, quite proud actually. Even when people think I'm speaking Dutch or try to make out I'm a bit thick.

Nobody ever asks people with "Queen's English" where their accent is from, do they? Never heard that anyway.

Did you ask this person what their ethnic background was? Or just where their accent was from?

Anyway, BAME....

I get asked about my accent too but it has nothing to do with my melanin

I'm afraid I like to know where people are from. I suppose I mean Manchester or Slough or whatever. I don't know why this is interesting but generally it leads to interesting conversations. It wouldn't be a first question - and often I'm asked it too.

I think this has nothing to do with using the lump-all-together BAME.

Oh well I have learned something already today as I have just been listening to a chap speak Doric what a lovely accent

Language changes as society begins to understand more. It’s unlikely you’d see patients described on psychiatric wards as lunatics. Or, people with learning difficulties as cretins or morons. These were acceptable terms, until they weren’t. The current terms will no doubt change along with attitudes, or a wish to generalise less, be specific more.

Finding the right language to describe non white people is currently centre stage. Little wonder given BLM and that interview for example. I was challenged about 20 years ago, after referring to a 15 year old as mixed race. No, she’s of dual heritage. She had white British, Irish, West Indian and North African heritage that we were certain of.

I don't have to stop using it - as I never started. I dislike these (supposedly) all-encompassing descriptive abbreviations for groups of people. After all, we are individuals.

Alegrias I just might have recognised the Doric, as my next-door neighbour has some choice Aberdeen expressions.

I think I said to my Western Isles acquaintance. "That sounds like Irish, are you from there?" but it was a while ago. Nowadays I wouldn't risk asking someone where they are from. I might phrase it so that it didn't imply a chance of the next sentence being "Why don't you go back there?" but I would never have been leading up to that in the first place.

However it is interesting to know where someone's roots are, and what brought them or their ancestors to these shores - without having nasty reasons for enquiring.

I certainly know of people from various minority ethnic groups who hate being all lumped together in this way.

I have also heard of black (Caribbean roots) people who feel quite distinct from black (African roots) people and really dislike being viewed as a homogenous group.

Trouble is Elegran, that as suzie says, the implication has often been there that if you look different you can't really be British. So I can understand why people get prickly about being asked about their ethnic origins.

I just don't agree with being interested in what brought people to these shores, unless they want to tell me. It really is none of my business.

Romesh Ranganathan (of Sri Lankan heritage) was using 'BAME' this morning on TV when talking about celebs encouraging groups with low vaccination take-up.
Groups that are discriminated against (WASPIs and BAME have been mentioned already) would probably be delighted for the tags and the discrimination to stop simultaneously.

Alegrias1

Other? Other?
It would only have been racist PamelaJ1 if you'd gone on to say "Yes, but where are you really from?"
It's not that hard, honestly.

I used the word other to illustrate that I am at a loss as to the word to use to describe anyone other than white. I thought the new acronym BAME was the but it seems not.

So tell me what is it. I can’t think that I would use it much but it would be useful to know just in case.

I'm not the slightest bit surprised that people currently labelled as BAME object. The term lumps together people from all sorts of different backgrounds and with different needs.

Even public perception differentiates between between, for example, people from a Chinese or Bangladeshi origin, but lumps them all together as "Asian".

It is useful for public planning to know that some areas have a high percentage of people from a certain ethnic background, because it is possible they might have different needs. For example, some people from certain backgrounds are prone to certain medical conditions, so it might be helpful to allocate funding for specialists. Schools might need extra funding to pay for EAL, etc.

However, the BAME label doesn't really help with the above because it doesn't differentiate between people. All it does is label people as "others" and people tend to shrug their shoulders and say "What do you expect? They're BAME". There's been quite a lot of that over the last few months with the pandemic.

Hetty58

I don't have to stop using it - as I never started. I dislike these (supposedly) all-encompassing descriptive abbreviations for groups of people. After all, we are individuals.

Well yes and no. It’s important to know the ethnic composition of particular areas when planning eg health services because rates of certain conditions vary between ethnicities.

Human beings is what I meant grandmajet.