What I think will happen tomorrow

Yes I agree growstuff with that analysis Starmer or whoever has an unenviable task.

I think the "working class" have changed but the Labour party hasn't. It still treats everyone as if they are working in mills and coal mines, are uneducated and unable to think for themselves. The majority of the electorate understand more than the Labour party give them credit for.

They want to be allowed to improve their lives and the lives of their families - like it or not whilst they support equality they are not impressed by politicians "taking the knee".

Urmstongran

Long way to go yet sw for London mayor. Pretty neck & neck right now but by tomorrow SK will emerge the winner. Shame really. I like Shaun Bailey.

Good grief! Is this a parody?

Saetana I think that really is Labour's problem. The "traditional" Labour voter had a manual job and was probably a member of a union. Until about the 1950s, the lives of such people were hard and sometimes precarious.

Fast forward 70 years and changes to society in the post-war years mean that those people are older, but considerably more secure. They probably own their own homes outright and have lived through a period of economic boom. Some of them live in towns now in decline and look back with nostalgia to times which seemed better.

Some of them blame the EU, immigration, "wokeness"/PC, students for the disappearance of values which they held dear and a society in which they personally flourished. Why on earth would they vote for a Labour Party which bangs on about food banks and poverty?

Hartlepool might be the tenth poorest town in the country, but the majority of people are not destitute and it's easy to blame those who are for the situation they are in.

The Conservatives understand all that. They won't do anything about it, but they can promise that they will. Hence, the appeal to the emotions with flags and nationalism rather than any coherent economic plans.

Meanwhile, the people who are really suffering are the young, who can't find secure employment and can't afford to start on the property ladder. They are possible well-educated, which is something the "traditional" Labour voter sometimes resents.

Society has gone (and is going) through a period of change. If Labour represents the underdogs, as it has done historically, the people at the bottom of the pile have changed and Labour is finding it difficult to find a niche. Add to that the 10-15% from an immigrant background. Some are discriminated against, so might seem like natural Labour voters, but many of them have come from quite wealthy backgrounds and have natural Conservative values economically and socially.

I desperately want to see a government other than the one we have, but I fear we won't get one if Labour continues to beat itself up about being socialist enough, class warfare and identity politics. It needs to find a way which will appeal to and benefit the majority of the population and that very well mean a total upheaval of traditional party affiliations. In fact, it would be surprising if it doesn't happen at some time, just as it has in other countries, notably the US in the twentieth century. I don't envy Starmer his role.

Boris won because of the brilliant vaccination programme. Dominic Cummings tried to stir things (Boris's wallpaper etc) cos he got booted out. Simple as that. ?

Fantastic comment Ursmtongran - you summed up the Labour party's problems in a nutshell. Northern "red wall"voters have zero interest in wokeism - or champagne socialists. Labour is no longer the party of the working classes - that is now the Conservatives. I want to see Labour make a resurgence because I believe in democracy and people having genuine options when it comes to elections. Jeremy Corbyn may not have been everyone's cup of tea, but he was a genuine old-fashioned socialist. The Labour party have lost their way, and seem to have no idea what exactly they stand for in 2021. I believe in a strong opposition - and Labour are not currently providing that. The loss in the by-election in Hartlepool should make the Labour leadership take a long hard look at themselves - the Conservative candidate had twice as many votes as Labout, despite Labour having held the seat for decades. I said to my husband a couple of days ago that I had no idea what the modern Labour party stand for. Clearly I am not the only one.

Urmstongran

Long way to go yet sw for London mayor. Pretty neck & neck right now but by tomorrow SK will emerge the winner. Shame really. I like Shaun Bailey.

Yes you would

Long way to go yet sw for London mayor. Pretty neck & neck right now but by tomorrow SK will emerge the winner. Shame really. I like Shaun Bailey.

Well you’ll all be delighted to know that my local council, stayed LD - well I am, they deserved to. CC stayed strongly Conservative but it’ll be interesting to see PCC results next week.

Well I never - Shaun Bailey not humiliated at all. Oh well, can’t get all my predictions right.

I’m really pleased Jackie Baillie (Labour) has kept her seat in Dumbartonshire. She can continue to be a thorn in Nicola Sturgeon’s side in Holyrood. Excellent result.

Dinahmo

MerylStreep

Tickingbird
I like your last sentence ?
Personally, I’m over the moon that the people of Hartlepool have given the Labour Party the finger.
The Westminster elite have had contempt for these people for how long?
But now at long last those people have shown their contempt for the Labour Party.

Surely the Westminster elite comprises more than one party? And it's not the LP that has the majority. Or have the Tories suddenly developed a true understanding of the working poor?

Dinahmo
It seems I’m a little bit behind with my terminology.
A Labour shadow minister has quit because he thinks the Labour Party are London based bourgeoisie and woke social media warriors

Why can't the BBC find presenters who can read?
Almost every time the results are read out, they get it wrong, apologise and then come out with the correct line.
(This also happens to the recording officers)
It's bad for my heart!
My 14 yr old DGS could do a better job.

If the people of Hartlepool were really so dead keen on kicking Labour out, how come so few people turned up to vote? It seems more likely they're beyond caring.

It would be great if my Conservative MP lost her seat at the GE because I'm not sure she even knows where the constituency she allegedly represents is situated. Sadly, her majority is so huge I doubt if it will happen.

GrannyGravy13

I do think that those folks who do not/have not voted/supported Conservatives are at a loss regarding what they or their MP’s, Councillors (or prospective MP’s Councillors) can now do to engage with the electorate.

Maybe listening to them would be a good starting place?

I didn't vote Conservative and I'm not any kind of loss. The Conservative county councillor lost his seat - probably because he didn't listen to the electorate until a couple of months ago. Serves him right!

GrannyGravy is your comment addressed to non Conservative voters in England only?

suziewoosieBBC One Wales.

I do think that those folks who do not/have not voted/supported Conservatives are at a loss regarding what they or their MP’s, Councillors (or prospective MP’s Councillors) can now do to engage with the electorate.

Maybe listening to them would be a good starting place?

"Labour cannot ignore 'verdict of the people', says Lord Adonis."

Hmm.

The same Lord Adonis who is still having a mental breakdown over the EU referendum in 2016 and was more than willing to ignore the 'verdict of the people'.

GrannyGravy13

Watching Grant Shapps on tonight’s briefing looks like he was in the new briefing room.

Well that makes it VFM then.Phew ?

tickingbird

^Just watched Keir Starmer squirming - a real treat^
There’s a few on here squirming too but trying to make light of it. It really is a treat ?

Funny what counts as a treat.

Casdon

Keir Starmer will be welcomed in Wales, Labour are doing well here, bucking the trend in England and increasing vote share in a number of the seats declared so far, I’m glued to my seat. The nations of the UK are dividing politically, it’s going to be interesting to see what happens next.

What channel are you watching please? Wales and Scotland just so interesting.

It is being reported that it’s tighter than expected for the London Mayoral election.

Just watched Keir Starmer squirming - a real treat
There’s a few on here squirming too but trying to make light of it. It really is a treat ?