Does the Government think that punching everyone in the face means no one will complain?

I just had to pop into Tesco and noticed the Daily Mail headline is "NHS fixed for a fiver" (or something of the sort). That is one big, fat lie!

MaizieD

theworriedwell

I realise that Maizie, people were saying income tax was harder to run than NI because of pensions and income like rental income. It wouldn't be hard at all.

I didn't actually say that it was easier to collect than income tax. I just said it was an easy tax to collect.

I have learned that NI contributions kick in earlier than income tax. So, a tax on the 'even poorer'?

Exactly! It kicks in at about £3k less than income tax - but only for those in paid jobs, not for rental or dividend income.

The net result will be a transfer of wealth from those in lower paid jobs to those who will inherit high value properties. It's not levelling up and I hope people see through it.

Dinahmo

Income tax is becoming easier to collect by the day. HMRC are able to access more information that you think about individuals.

Yes by the day, Real Time Information makes it that easy.

Income tax is becoming easier to collect by the day. HMRC are able to access more information that you think about individuals.

growstuff

PippaZ

The stupidity of this is if you actually raise it pensioners, particularly those only on state pension or state pension and benefits will spend most of it. That helps the economy - doesn't it?

I do not trust them an inch.

Neither do I and that's why I hope people do see through the sham.

It's a fact I have pointed out many times on here but it's usually ignored or greeted with disbelief.

theworriedwell

I realise that Maizie, people were saying income tax was harder to run than NI because of pensions and income like rental income. It wouldn't be hard at all.

I didn't actually say that it was easier to collect than income tax. I just said it was an easy tax to collect.

I have learned that NI contributions kick in earlier than income tax. So, a tax on the 'even poorer'?

PippaZ

The stupidity of this is if you actually raise it pensioners, particularly those only on state pension or state pension and benefits will spend most of it. That helps the economy - doesn't it?

I do not trust them an inch.

Neither do I and that's why I hope people do see through the sham.

PippaZ

I'm sure you are right. I did notice Johnson kept assuring people that the pay Carers get will be improved. However, I have a strong feeling the devil will be in the detail when it comes to paying for your care.

I suspect market forces will push up wages because there's a shortage of carers. That is no guarantee that the quality will improve nor that support will become more available.

PS. There already was a career and training structure for carers. A friend of mine was an NVQ assessor for carers. She was formerly employed by the NHS and ultimately resigned because assessment was market-led and she was so appalled at the poor training being provided in the private sector.

The stupidity of this is if you actually raise it pensioners, particularly those only on state pension or state pension and benefits will spend most of it. That helps the economy - doesn't it?

I do not trust them an inch.

Hopefully, the former Labour voters who voted Conservative in the last election will give their brains a good wobble.

I'm sure you are right. I did notice Johnson kept assuring people that the pay Carers get will be improved. However, I have a strong feeling the devil will be in the detail when it comes to paying for your care.

Well, now we know. The pension triple lock has been suspended for a year. Presumably, this has been announced on the same day as the increase in NICs to take the heat out of inter-generational arguments.

theworriedwell

I realise that Maizie, people were saying income tax was harder to run than NI because of pensions and income like rental income. It wouldn't be hard at all.

I agree with you worriedwell.

PippaZ

Just thinking that the only way Carers will get a reasonable rate of pay is to make the jobs in Care and the jobs in Health interchangeable.

That won't happen because care and NHS workers usually have different employers.

A few years ago, there was a shift in responsibility for adult social care from the NHS to councils and the private sector. Councils have now usually outsourced to the private sector.

One outcome was that NHS employees were made redundant and some were re-employed by the private sector with worse terms and conditions.

Just thinking that the only way Carers will get a reasonable rate of pay is to make the jobs in Care and the jobs in Health interchangeable.

Johnson completely dodged the question of how this would have been funded if not for the pandemic (ie what was his 'ready to go' plan at the election?)

There was no mention of paying NI contributions from state pension - I took it to mean that if people of state pension age chose to carry on working, they would pay NI on salary payments - at the moment NI stops at the point where state pension kicks in. I do think Theresa May’s plan was fairer - at least there would be something left to pass on as an inheritance.

I realise that Maizie, people were saying income tax was harder to run than NI because of pensions and income like rental income. It wouldn't be hard at all.

theworriedwell

My private pension is taxed with no issue, every year my old employer is sent my new tax code which must be worked out from them knowing how much my SRP is for the year. I used to have rental properties, sold them last year as had enough of the hassle, but no issue paying tax on the rent. You just fill out a tax return every year.

Unearned income, such as from rentals, won't be touched because NICs aren't paid on it.

My private pension is taxed with no issue, every year my old employer is sent my new tax code which must be worked out from them knowing how much my SRP is for the year. I used to have rental properties, sold them last year as had enough of the hassle, but no issue paying tax on the rent. You just fill out a tax return every year.

Piffle-waffle in reply by Johnson. When has the opposition offered a plan?

Scotland is not going to be happy.

growstuff

Ironically, May's plan for social care was much fairer. It would have meant that people had to pay for social care but were guaranteed to be left with a a certain amount (£100k I think). This would have benefitted people with low value property more than those with higher value property. I could understand why some Tory backbenchers went mad about it, but I never could understand why Labour objected. I came to the conclusion that people didn't understand what was being proposed.

If the plans which have been leaked today are actually enacted, they are a disgrace. It will mean people on lower incomes paying for the inheritances of the better off. Again, I wonder if people really understand what is being proposed.

Absolutely this.

Starmer is speaking now, and seems to me to be talking sense.

PippaZ

I'm not sure if you can re-run Sky News Maizie. If you can I will check back on what he said. I think it was something to do with the employers share of NI going up.

No, that's OK, Pippa. growstuff has interpreted it for me.

Wasn't the statutory minimum wage going to lead to inflation, growstuff? Did it in fact happen?

Fourth time he has said NHS in first paragraph. He got Brexit by using the NHS and into power by using the NHS. He will now increase taxes by using it yet again. What a charlatan.

Can't hypothicate it for ever. It can always be changed. Liar.

"Care" suddenly means cancer, etc.

I'm not sure if you can re-run Sky News Maizie. If you can I will check back on what he said. I think it was something to do with the employers share of NI going up.