Don’t underestimate this u-turn

O crikey WWM I had no idea... why would she even say that if she wants to get people working?

I'm asking was it always so? Were we always thought of as lazy?
Is it a myth?
Just pondering...

Alegrias no, not the lazy Brit trope, just a matter of numbers. And I didn't say that all people are lazy, it's just that there are some jobs that people haven't fancied doing in recent times. After all, there are people, for example those in the theatre, who took work as food delivery drivers etc during the pandemic.

I'm just fed up with every hiccup being a stick to beat the government with (no I don't think they are getting things right) and the divisions this causes in society. Both Brexit and Covid are new situations and whoever was in charge they'd get at least some things wrong. What happened to pulling together.

And, for what it's worth, I think the referendum was badly organised. The vote was far too close - the percentage difference should have had to be much wider for it to have counted.

And didn’t Farage say we would have a Norway style relationship? I.e. stay in single market? A hard Brexit was NOT what majority voted for.

NotSpaghetti

O crikey WWM I had no idea... why would she even say that if she wants to get people working?

I'm asking was it always so? Were we always thought of as lazy?
Is it a myth?
Just pondering...

?. Honestly why would we be any lazier than any other worker in the world?

Of course we aren’t. We, however may not be prepared to work for very poor pay and/or conditions though, and why shouldn’t we?

That is why we have such an aged set of lorry drivers who have grown up with the extremely bad conditions and relatively poor pay.
The young are simply not prepared to put up with it and good on them I say.

What I'd like to know is why aren't there enough people in Britain to do all the jobs?

There isn’t a balance between the jobs that need doing and the number of people available to do them, that always adds up to zero. When there was free movement, people from all over Europe could move to the place where there were jobs that suited their qualifications and ambitions. Now they can’t. For many of us, moving from the UK to Spain to work was exactly the same as moving from Sussex to Yorkshire. Can you imagine if there were rules that said you couldn’t move from Sussex to Yorkshire? Would people be saying “why can’t all the Yorkshire people do the jobs, they must be lazy?”

Silly analogy, I know, but I think it works.

If the government had been bright enough to work out that there were going to be issues because of lack of suitably trained people to do the jobs, they had 5 years to do something about it, between 2016 and 2021. But they didn’t bother. So I’ll be continuing to beat the government Septimia, with any stick I can find.

Apparently they were continually told by the businesses but their ideologues refused to listen.

Then Alegrias, I hope you'll beat any government in the same way, because none of them are perfect.

NotSpaghetti

O crikey WWM I had no idea... why would she even say that if she wants to get people working?

I'm asking was it always so? Were we always thought of as lazy?
Is it a myth?
Just pondering...

I grew up in an "Irish" pub in a big English city. When young men came over to work on the roads, building sites, factories etc in the 1950s and 1960s they all felt the English were lazy. I don't know if it was true as I was a schoolgirl but it was definitely how people talked.

It suits business to call our workers lazy rather than reduce prophets and pay a proper wage and ensure good conditions.

Septimia

Then Alegrias, I hope you'll beat any government in the same way, because none of them are perfect.

I'll certainly call them out for their shortcomings. That's what you're expected to do in a democracy, it's how it works.

However, some are more egregiously useless than others.

To clarify when I say they all I don't mean every Irishman who came over, I mean the ones who drank in our pub and we knew them.

"I'm just fed up with every hiccup being a stick to beat the government with"

Current 'hiccups' include:-

The army driving ambulances is Scotland.
Chemotherapy being rationed due to staff shortages.
Waste collections delayed/cancelled due to staff shortages.
Petrol not being delivered to points of sale.
18% of people reporting not being able to buy essential food in the last week.
1,500 in hospital in Scotland purely because no suitable social care is available.
136,000 Coronavirus related deaths.

Stick-worthy hiccups.

The Times are suggesting the next Uturn could be on meat processing staff.

Scones

The Times are suggesting the next Uturn could be on meat processing staff.

It has to be with Christmas upon them.

Pity the NHS isn’t seen as so important.

vegansrock

And didn’t Farage say we would have a Norway style relationship? I.e. stay in single market? A hard Brexit was NOT what majority voted for.

It wasn’t just Farage. I thought ( happy to be corrected on this) that a lot of the people supporting the leave campaign said we’d still be staying in the single market?

MayBee70

vegansrock

And didn’t Farage say we would have a Norway style relationship? I.e. stay in single market? A hard Brexit was NOT what majority voted for.

It wasn’t just Farage. I thought ( happy to be corrected on this) that a lot of the people supporting the leave campaign said we’d still be staying in the single market?

Yes, I can even remember some Brexiters on GN who said it made sense to do so.

Something to amuse - Marina Hyde yesterday

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/sep/24/uk-prime-minister-shortage-crisis-boris-johnson-new-york

A major chilled food distributor has gone into liquidation. The supply Sainsbury and Asda.

The JiT used by the single market is collapsing, bring catastrophe to these sort of businesses.

That arch Brexiteer Tim Martin is demanding changes to the immigration laws so that he can import foreign labour for his pubs.

Europe also has a driver shortage and anyway importing drivers is not the answer as many younger drivers left the industry due to the hours they were expected to work and the way they were being treated.

M0nica

*The media will play this down*

What evidence, ahead of the event that this will happen?

Surely you should have an open mind and judge events as they come. You also need to consider that others may not see this event as being as humiliating or as significant as you do.

I am not offering any opinion on this subject at all at the moment.

It looks as if 6 month temporary visas are being granted to EU HGV drivers to help ease the problem .....and why not? This is sensible and what we who voted to leave the EU wanted, not unlimited freedom of movement but controlled immigration.
In certain areas, ( the haulage industry specifically) we should feel free to do what is needed.
The only problem I can see is because there is a Europe wide shortage of drivers we may struggle to get them....firms will have to offer more money than they can earn at home.
Eastern European drivers are the most likely to apply.

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Scones

"I'm just fed up with every hiccup being a stick to beat the government with"

Current 'hiccups' include:-

The army driving ambulances is Scotland.
Chemotherapy being rationed due to staff shortages.
Waste collections delayed/cancelled due to staff shortages.
Petrol not being delivered to points of sale.
18% of people reporting not being able to buy essential food in the last week.
1,500 in hospital in Scotland purely because no suitable social care is available.
136,000 Coronavirus related deaths.

Stick-worthy hiccups.

Not so.
Staff shortages for delivering chemotherapy and waste collections are due to Covid.
Petrol ( no shortage) just BP having problems
Army helping out by driving ambulances....all good! That’s the government stepping up to the plate ( and NS requested it.)
We have just been through a terrible pandemic and yet it appears some people are outraged at the consequences....the same government got us all early vaccinations, remember?
They are not miracle workers.