Is English cricket, not just Yorkshire cricket, institutionally racist?

Alegrias do you remember the coloured Scottish character in 'Porridge'? He was called Black Jock! Somehow I doubt that would be allowed these days. I found it pretty shocking back then.

winterwhite

It seems to me that it's endemic in any sport involving all-male teams, which is most physical team sports. Sexism is rife in the same way. Sport engenders competition which encourages male cliquiness, ganging up and locker room talk.

This makes it very difficult to correct.

So far as I know this doesn't happen in women's team sports.

I think this is true, an interesting point.

Aveline

Alegrias do you remember the coloured Scottish character in 'Porridge'? He was called Black Jock! Somehow I doubt that would be allowed these days. I found it pretty shocking back then.

Oh, I'd forgotten about that! We've moved on, haven't we?

I think some of the worst racism was against the Irish- still is in some quarters. I have never come across racism towards Scottish people, ever and I am largely Scottish myself.

I am sick to death about this whistle blower …he was compensated years ago for it and is still going on about it …there are photos of him in a cricket too with “P..I POWER “ on the front ,he had apologised for his slur on Jews (and that’s alright ..NOT …he is raking up things that happened years ago (I am not saying what was said was correct) people are losing jobs and he is still smug about it …his past will come back and bite him and I hope he realises his errors and people will see him for what he is …And before people think I am racist ..I am not …but it becoming ridiculous now

There a difference between an anti semitic text when someone was a teenager ( not saying it is Ok) and systematic face to face racism in a dressing room and club.Both are unacceptable and need to be called out, but they don’t cancel each other out. Of course someone who is a victim of racism can also be guilty of racism, just as someone who is bullied can get up and punch the bully. It doesn’t mean we ignore it or pretend it didn’t happen.

I've never felt the need to tell anyone I'm not racist.

They can usually tell because I don't behave in a way that would make them think I am.

And BTW P* Power is a cricket team in Melbourne. "Power" is a named used by sports teams. Was Rafiq wearing their shirt? Or was it just someone who you thought looked like him

Aveline
You were offended by the term black jock
Far more back people will be offended by your coloured Scottish character description.

vegansrock

There a difference between an anti semitic text when someone was a teenager ( not saying it is Ok) and systematic face to face racism in a dressing room and club.Both are unacceptable and need to be called out, but they don’t cancel each other out. Of course someone who is a victim of racism can also be guilty of racism, just as someone who is bullied can get up and punch the bully. It doesn’t mean we ignore it or pretend it didn’t happen.

Exactly. We all have entrenched attitudes about race & ethnicity, if we grew up white. Even if we have multi-ethnic families. Having and dealthing with the attitudes is one thing. Denying they're there, while also trying to shut down the experiences of a person of colour is quite another.

vegansrock

There a difference between an anti semitic text when someone was a teenager ( not saying it is Ok) and systematic face to face racism in a dressing room and club.Both are unacceptable and need to be called out, but they don’t cancel each other out. Of course someone who is a victim of racism can also be guilty of racism, just as someone who is bullied can get up and punch the bully. It doesn’t mean we ignore it or pretend it didn’t happen.

Yes, Thank you. Any of us who can stand up and say we didn't do or say stupid things as teenagers, must be few and far between. NO comparison whatsoever.

And yes, your post did display blatant racism Marmite- the fact you have to insist it doesn't, makes that clear.

Of course cricket is institutionally racist.... as is the whole of human society. Managing it is the problem, so we don't end up with a Holocaust like Nazi Germany or Rwanda.

although wrong he was a teenager and we say stupid things as teenagers.

This excuses racism in the playground

Nothing excuses racism, ever. Even if its the little darlings in the playground.

But Rafiq doing something racist doesn't negate the racism that he himself suffered. They are both unacceptable.

Why should anti semitic slurs be alright when people are teenagers. I'm afraid this has shown that at times we all will have intentianly or unitentianly made racist slurs.It does not mean I condone it.
I have had a Pakistani child have a screaming fit when realising they had eaten bacon crisps at a party. The food was sent in by parents. They did not set out to insult they just never thought and neither did I.
We are all much more aware now and should stop and think.
Non of us are exempt from this, someone I know went through child hood known as a wee Sassenach one parent English the other Scots. I myself habitually called Scots people"Lockerbie Jock", I must have picked it up from adults I did not know where Lockerbie was.
At school the people who's mothers were German often had it thrust at them and we also called people D.P.'s because their fathers had been captured as prisoners of war and never went back because their country was then in the USSR.
We all need to to think ,change our ways and not condemn what we might have unintentionally done ourselves.

Anti Semitic slurs are never OK, jeez, why is this so hard? Nobody is excusing his behaviour.

Sassenach is Gaelic for English person. I'd never use it because people now consider it a slur if used out of context. If you'd called me Lockerbie Jock I'd have thought you were a bit daft and probably avoided you.

Yes both are unacceptable so dismissing one with ‘he was a teenager’ is wrong in my opinion.

My elder granddaughter when age 15 was mocked for sharing
swotting time for exams with the son of a Gurkha . Still those
mocking were only 15 and we do and say stupid things as teenagers.

I have to be honest and say that some of these slurs mentioned by others, I have never heard of, in particular those used for English or Scottish people.

Racism expressed by teenagers is still racism. Even expressed by tiny children, although often they are saying what they’ve heard others say, and may not understand the true meaning.

The Welsh are called ‘sheep shaggers’

katy1950

I think they are all as bad as each other all the races seems to use offence words against each other and unfortunately the media as decided that the caucasians seem to be classed as the worst

His complaint wasn't just about words though was it? Holding a teenage boy down and pouring alcohol down his throat cannot be acceptable, if that boy is a Muslim it is even worse.

Holding a teenage girl down and pouring alcohol down her throat is also not acceptable.

Anybody else totally confused as to what it is now acceptable to say, and what isn't?

Lincslass

Rafiq has just apologised for anti Semitic tweets he made a few years ago. So that’s alright then?
www.skysports.com/cricket/news/12123/12471808/rafiq-apologises-for-antisemitic-comments-he-sent-in-2011

It illustrates that most use slurs at some time.a more fruitful way of him calling out his racist abuse problem would be to upfront tell everyone that he too did it in his younger years! Then to say maybe it didn't hit home how damning it was until he was at the receiving end of the abuse? Not to go down the "poor me" route. He too admits foul behaviour at the expense of our African friends and.....well me! Being Jewish! Everyone needs to examine consciences admit our bad behaviour and make every effort to right the ongoing wrongs.

All the filth crawling out of the woodwork now in sport and elsewhere illustrates just how childish immature and spoiled they all are!! Remember Freddy Flintoff getting blasted at downing Street and disgracing himself and team? And it continues to get a laugh! Why?? Deeply unfunny. And strange that Lewis Hamilton one of our top achieving world record smashing absolutely darling low key heroes gets?...........a paltry MBE!!! no knighthood? Well it's not cos he's not quite good enough at what he does is it?

I think if you portay someone as all good and someone as all bad, it's going to end in a mess. Life and human beings are much more complex than that.

tattygran14

Anybody else totally confused as to what it is now acceptable to say, and what isn't?

No, not really. Just don't be racist.