Does Boris Johnson ever tell the truth?

Alegrias1

^Does any politician ever really tell the truth or do they just repeat snippets of statistics and information they are given in order to suit their purpose?^

I do not believe that the majority of serious politicians repeat unproven bits and pieces that they have been told to say by their staff. They are not performing parrots. To say such a thing is not fair to the many politicians who take their elected positions seriously and are actually in politics for the good of the people, not themselves.

The media manipulate stories but many (most?) people are able to appreciate that all media have a bias and are able to interpret the news with that understanding. Some, sadly, seem to be unable to do that.

When a politician tells an outright lie, anybody with any experience of the real world is able to tell it’s a lie. Usually. e.g. There wasn’t a party, but if there a party was all the rules were followed. A 3-year old would come up with a better lie. (Johnson has a tell, have you noticed? Silly little smirk and he wrinkles up his eyes.)

Everyone is allowed to have their own opinion. But to tarnish the reputation of politicians who are not in the job just for themselves, along with not knowing the difference between opinion and fact, is not something to be proud of.

So everybody saying how Ange27 is spot on – reconsider. Because she’s not.

Alegrias1 I am wrong because you say so? You have twisted my post to suit your agenda and you have actually proved my point entirely.

No, sorry, you are wrong, because you are clearly ...

no other of saying it - just wrong.

Can somebody explain my agenda to me please?

(I think its not believing nonsense, but I'll consider other ideas, if you've got them.)

In my opinion (to which I'm entitled), I can't see much that is "spot on" or "summed up the situation very well* in Ange27's post. In my opinion, Alegrias1 made some valid comments. She introduced her post by "I believe ..." and she is perfectly entitled to a belief without having some kind of agenda.

I am new to Gransnet and obviously didn't realise that as my views don't tally with the vocal minority they don't count.
I had written a very long post explaining exactly why I am not wrong but decided it is simply not worth discussing it with those who are only interested in their own opinions.
It's the same few as far as I can see who throw their weight around dismissing those that they don't agree with. Don't you ever get fed up of feeling so superior?

New here- are you sure?

new to Gransnet, my arse

Ange27, if you really want a proper discussion on this discussion site, especially on the News and Politics forum, you've got to be ready to defend your ideas. If you just want to post what you think and not get argued with, you've going to be disappointed.

You said what you think, I said what I think. They happen to differ. C'est la vie.

It is in the interests of the rightwing press to ignore Johnson's lies and/or encourage the cynical "all politicians are liars" narrative.

Indeed, and it has the added advantage for those who voted for Johnson that it allows them to deflect the conversation away from his lies into a defence of everyone else.

JaneJudge .

I have read your post carefully, Ange27 and I think that you are saying that Johnson's lies could have been taken out of context.

The problem is that many of his lies have been fact checked and proven to be just that, lies. We could take as a starting point his infamous £350million per week on the side of a red bus. It was the ONS that pointed out that it wasn't a true figure.

Peter Oborne wrote a whole book on his lies, all fact checked. The lies in the video were fact checked. His lies are constantly fact checked and disproved. Can you show that they are not?

No, it has never been like this before because we have never before had a PM who lies so hard, so consistently and so transparently. He is long, long past being given the benefit of the doubt. He disgraces his office and he disgraces his country and people are extremely upset and angry about it.

Doodledog

*It is in the interests of the rightwing press to ignore Johnson's lies and/or encourage the cynical "all politicians are liars" narrative.*

Indeed, and it has the added advantage for those who voted for Johnson that it allows them to deflect the conversation away from his lies into a defence of everyone else.

JaneJudge .

Absolutely. It makes me angry when people dismiss Johnson's lies by saying that all MPs lie. They don't. Some may not have the same views as me, some may be like mine in a very safe seat and complacent but he isn't a liar. Saying they are all the same is just an excuse for voting for Johnson and his cronies again.

Ange27

I am new to Gransnet and obviously didn't realise that as my views don't tally with the vocal minority they don't count.
I had written a very long post explaining exactly why I am not wrong but decided it is simply not worth discussing it with those who are only interested in their own opinions.
It's the same few as far as I can see who throw their weight around dismissing those that they don't agree with. Don't you ever get fed up of feeling so superior?

For somebody new to Gransnet, you seem very quick to judge other posters. Personally, I believe much that you wrote in your post was wrong - as did Alegrias, so it would appear. We are entitled to believe you are wrong and to express that belief. That's how discussion works. That doesn't mean that we think we are superior, nor does expressing an opposing belief mean throwing one's weight around.

Does Boris Johnson ever tell the truth? No!

I wonder whether other world leaders such as Merkel, Ardern, Biden , Macron etc feel the need to dress up in different outfits when visiting an organisation? Or are they
they grownups?

JaneJudge

GrannyGravy13

Alegrias1

Now I know its not nice to make fun of people because of how they look, but sometimes its worth making an exception.

Here's Johnson lying about being a policeman and about his ability to get himself dressed in the morning.

I am not a fan of the PM however, saying he is lying about being a policeman is not correct.
He has been with a drug squad (I believe in Merseyside) whilst they are carrying out raids.

Has been trying them out too, just to make sure ?

Are you aware of slander laws. Would you say that to his face. No guess not, hiding behind your keyboard safe.

Yes, I'd definitely say it to his face.

If I was face to face with him, me telling him he was a liar would be the least of his worries about the conversation.

“Would you say that to his face. No, guess not”. I think you guess wrong.

It's the 'bare faced' quality of the lies that surprises me. There's no subtlety, no disguise - and no apologies.

I'm not sure what statement Lincslass is suggesting would fall foul of the slander laws. It certainly can't be the statement that Johnson is a liar. There would be writs flying in all directions if it was truly slanderous. But Johnson hasn't sued anyone, presumably because he knows they're telling the truth...

Dawn Butler said in in the Commons chamber and Ian Blackford said it more recently n the same place, albeit in a slightly more carefully worded fashion. Is he suing them?

Hetty58

It's the 'bare faced' quality of the lies that surprises me. There's no subtlety, no disguise - and no apologies.

Why should there be? He's PM with a big majority and does what he pleases. He's completely indifferent to the effects of his lies. Why bother with apologies?

He would have gained more respect if he travelled past Liverpool and went up to the NE and gave support to the people who have been with out services for the last 10 days.
Somehow I can't imagine him up a pole in a hard hat & florescent jacket

MaizieD

Hetty58

It's the 'bare faced' quality of the lies that surprises me. There's no subtlety, no disguise - and no apologies.

Why should there be? He's PM with a big majority and does what he pleases. He's completely indifferent to the effects of his lies. Why bother with apologies?

Not only does our undemocratic FPTP electoral system give a huge majority to a party which is opposed by the majority of voters, it allows MPs in "safe seats" to show utter contempt for their constituents and that has been very clearly demonstrated by the second jobs scandal.

If we cannot achieve electoral reform and transform the UK into a democracy, we run the risk of having another authoritarian PM even worse than Johnson- and I dread to think what the result could be.

www.electoral-reform.org.uk/we-must-end-the-link-between-safe-seats-and-second-jobs/

Not all MPs are the same and I have taken quite a liking to Zarah Sultana after she refused to withdraw calling certain Conservatives Dodgy.

Ange27 I've just reread your first post. It doesn't help your cause that the only lie you use as an example is WMDs. That was nearly 20 years ago and there have been many, many lies since then.

Alegrias1

Now I know its not nice to make fun of people because of how they look, but sometimes its worth making an exception.

Here's Johnson lying about being a policeman and about his ability to get himself dressed in the morning.

Jed mercurio, creator of Line of Duty, wrote on Twitter that he thanked the PM for submitting his audition for the next series of Line of Duty before adding “but we’re looking for a character with at least one redeeming moral principle and a performance that places even a scintilla of doubt in the audience’s mind that he might not be totally bent”