Lord Frost has resigned

Urmstongran

Thank you for your interest Parsley3. This is more how discourse should be in my opinion!

You are right. I’m gutted.
As to who will take over I’ve no idea. ?
I hope for someone strong and informed. Obviously the Remainers on here would hope for a weak sap as to’bring us ever closer’ to the EU.

Time will tell I suppose Parsley3.
Do you have a view yourself?

You're gutted? Get over it!

is deregulation, removal of workers rights and protections, privatisation of the NHS etc what you had in mind when you voted leave?

Yes *MaizieD^ some deregulation for sure. Too much red tape. And remember the UK was actually ahead of the EU on worker’s rights - minimum wage etc - and on animal welfare.

The NHS needs a complete overhaul - it’s not that brilliant. As most of us already realise. Months ago I posited reorganisation ought to be a cross party issue so it doesn’t keep getting kicked around like the proverbial football into the long grass.

Actually the UK was far behind The Netherlands on workers rights. Not sure how the other EU countries compare as I haven’t lived there but Holland was way ahead.
Also their education system and health care was streets ahead of ours and remains so.

Urmstongran there’s nothing wrong with the NHS that adequate funding and removal from malign political interference wouldn’t resolve. The deterioration in the last 10 years is down to the Government.

Not surprised really dragonfly they are happy to pay more tax. We try our best on a shoestring budget.

There was nothing to stop as as EU members to have higher minimum wages, to run our own health service into the ground , we had autonomy over 96%of our laws, so this idea that we had no sovereignty so much rubbish.

Brexit has produced oodles more red tape that’s for sure.

So respectfully disagree Casdon. I worked for almost 40y in the NHS. Blair promised much. Shiny baubles. The ‘Agenda for Change’ 20 years ago W pended up a disaster. GP ‘s did fabulously well. So much so, many decided they could well afford to go part time (who could blame them with that largesse?). Ditto PPI. Many hospital Trusts are still in hock over that one. (Some are STILL paying out 10% of their annual budget). A nightmare and not just on Elm Street. Ultimately the taxpayer picks up that tab.

I did too Urmstongran, for 42 years in fact. I remember Agenda for Change well, and it didn’t include doctors at all.
Wikipedia:
‘Agenda for Change (AfC) is the current National Health Service (NHS) grading and pay system for NHS staff, with the exception of doctors, dentists, apprentices and some senior managers.’

Casdon, can I just say that reading your posts makes me very happy?

Frost was banging his head against the EU wall, Liz Truss will do exactly the same, they have not given a millimeter, nor will they.
As for the direction we are being taken, we are rudderless, unable to steer a steady course because Brexit and Covid together is the worst storm imaginable.
What goes around comes around, Beleaguered Boris is now getting his just reward for all the lies and half truths of the past few years.

Yes *MaizieD some deregulation for sure. Too much red tape. And remember the UK was actually ahead of the EU on worker’s rights - minimum wage etc - and on animal welfare.^

Blimey, Ug. Were you ever a 'worker' yourself?

Did you benefit from statutory working hours, statutory sick pay, statutory maternity leave, statutory holiday entitlement, statutory minimum wage? Health and safety at work legislation?

That's all the stuff they want to get rid of All the stuff that you so proudly say that we were ahead of the EU on....

And would you care to tell me exactly what it was that the EU offered Cameron?

Based on what would seem to be a politically biased memory of the NHS I can now begin to understand why you swallowed all the nonsense, lies and guff put out by the Leave campaign Urmonstongran. You believe what suits your agenda and deny anything which proves you to have wrong. Does your idea of re-organising the NHS include selling chunks of it off? Did any of your daughters/daughters in law enjoy maternity pay and protection of their employment? If so, why would you deny this to my DD and DiL who have yet to start their families?

Yes it's all Urmstongran fault ? (only joking) and yes I voted for Brexit and would do so again.

Urmstongran

Thank you for your interest Parsley3. This is more how discourse should be in my opinion!

You are right. I’m gutted.
As to who will take over I’ve no idea. ?
I hope for someone strong and informed. Obviously the Remainers on here would hope for a weak sap as to’bring us ever closer’ to the EU.

Time will tell I suppose Parsley3.
Do you have a view yourself?

You do realise that Frost was 100% a totally convinced Remainer- who just turned coat to get a bit of power and promotion, as well as a very high salary and to become a Lord. That he is NOT a politician, NOT elected by anyone, and just a jumped up turn-coat civil servant.

Kali2

Urmstongran

Thank you for your interest Parsley3. This is more how discourse should be in my opinion!

You are right. I’m gutted.
As to who will take over I’ve no idea. ?
I hope for someone strong and informed. Obviously the Remainers on here would hope for a weak sap as to’bring us ever closer’ to the EU.

Time will tell I suppose Parsley3.
Do you have a view yourself?

You do realise that Frost was 100% a totally convinced Remainer- who just turned coat to get a bit of power and promotion, as well as a very high salary and to become a Lord. That he is NOT a politician, NOT elected by anyone, and just a jumped up turn-coat civil servant.

Liz Truss was the same. In her view, pre referendum, leaving the EU would be a disaster and a terrible thing for our children.

Amazing how a sniff of power can completely change one's ideas...

Indeed- but at least she was elected. What a dire situation to be in!?!

Obviously the Remainers on here would hope for a weak sap as to ’bring us ever closer’ to the EU.

See I think this is what gets up our noses. Up mine, anyway

I'm hoping for a good negotiator who will get the best possible deal for the UK without alienating our nearest neighbours, and who will commit to a deal we can honour.

I don't want a person who thinks everyone is out to get us and the only way to succeed is for their interlocutors to "lose", so that they can look like a hard (wo)man to the troops back home.

But then I actually know Europeans. I mean actually know them, I don't just dine in their restaurants or drink at their bars. I worked with them, I am friends with them, and I don't want to "beat" them.

Alegrias1

^Obviously the Remainers on here would hope for a weak sap as to ’bring us ever closer’ to the EU.^

See I think this is what gets up our noses. Up mine, anyway

I'm hoping for a good negotiator who will get the best possible deal for the UK without alienating our nearest neighbours, and who will commit to a deal we can honour.

I don't want a person who thinks everyone is out to get us and the only way to succeed is for their interlocutors to "lose", so that they can look like a hard (wo)man to the troops back home.

But then I actually know Europeans. I mean actually know them, I don't just dine in their restaurants or drink at their bars. I worked with them, I am friends with them, and I don't want to "beat" them.

??I totally agree.

Alegrias ''I'm hoping for a good negotiator who will get the best possible deal for the UK without alienating our nearest neighbours, and who will commit to a deal we can honour.''

but the Deal has been negotiated, and signed - quite a long time ago. What is changing negotiator now going to achieve at this stage?

Of course this will be dismissed as being Polly Toynbee int he Guardian - but many of us will agree she is so so right

''If the Tories purge their leader, they’ll install someone infected by yet more unpopular small-statery. It’s in their nature. But it’s those who chose Johnson who are the problem, too many of them are the fanatics and fantasists who brought us the great Brexit delusion. Look how Steve Baker just “cancelled” the culture secretary, Nadine Dorries, from his 100-strong Clean Global Brexit WhatsApp group of MPs to see quite how divided and factious they are; how remote from voters. Can they recover from this frenzy in time? Never underestimate their focus on power, but what would it take to revive a party that lionised David Frost, and basks in all this outlandish Steve Bakerism?

Kali2

Alegrias ''I'm hoping for a good negotiator who will get the best possible deal for the UK without alienating our nearest neighbours, and who will commit to a deal we can honour.''

but the Deal has been negotiated, and signed - quite a long time ago. What is changing negotiator now going to achieve at this stage?

Fair comment Kali2.

Mine was really in response to the ridiculous suggestion that people who voted remain want the UK represented by someone who will just roll over and not serve our interests properly.

Yes, I got that.

There really is nothing to negotiate, the deal was signed, we spent a year trying to wriggle out of it and got nowhere, we either trade within EU rules or we trade elsewhere.

But it’s not that simple yes, we can make reciprocal barriers but we are always at a disadvantage, everything we produce has to be to their standards, in addition all the other nations have a trading relationship with the EU that they value.

Brexit is done we live with it

MaizieD

Kali2

Urmstongran

Thank you for your interest Parsley3. This is more how discourse should be in my opinion!

You are right. I’m gutted.
As to who will take over I’ve no idea. ?
I hope for someone strong and informed. Obviously the Remainers on here would hope for a weak sap as to’bring us ever closer’ to the EU.

Time will tell I suppose Parsley3.
Do you have a view yourself?

You do realise that Frost was 100% a totally convinced Remainer- who just turned coat to get a bit of power and promotion, as well as a very high salary and to become a Lord. That he is NOT a politician, NOT elected by anyone, and just a jumped up turn-coat civil servant.

Liz Truss was the same. In her view, pre referendum, leaving the EU would be a disaster and a terrible thing for our children.

Amazing how a sniff of power can completely change one's ideas...

You see that everywhere …I’ve seen teachers change their views on hop over to the dark side the minute they’re given some random promoted post !!