Two Years of Keir Starmer. What do we think?

Casdon

I’ve got a long memory. This was August 2020, Starmer had been in the role less than 4 months.
www.gransnet.com/forums/news_and_politics/1283299-on-both-sides-of-the-pond-the-extreme-left-is-scuppering-their-own-cause?pg=8

So I checked. Quite specific posts by me of the things I criticised in Starmer's behaviour. His attitude towards asylum seekers. And some general comments about what appeal he would have to the public. That still applies. He had shown no signs of dealing with the allegations of wrong doing in head office.
It wouldn't have taken a week to establish a proper investigation. He didn't do so. He did in July 2020 pay out a huge amount to those who acted against Labour's interests in the 2017 election.
It might only have been 4 months but his path was clearly marked.
It's interesting as well to look at his attitude to second jobs before he became leader. It's further evidence of his duplicity. Much like Boris he uses language to dodge the bullet, he wasn't in talks, he was in discussions- www.express.co.uk/news/politics/1518590/Keir-Starmer-squirming-confrontation-second-job-sleaze-row-Labour-party-Tory-Sky-news-vn

I’ve got a long memory. This was August 2020, Starmer had been in the role less than 4 months.
www.gransnet.com/forums/news_and_politics/1283299-on-both-sides-of-the-pond-the-extreme-left-is-scuppering-their-own-cause?pg=8

ps as for the antisemitism in the LP - as a newcomer to Jewdaism I've worked out (maybe wrongly?) that Jews will support the party who seem to like Israel. Zionist or not.
For the Orthodox - the party who allows shechita and the ability to have schools who have the freedom to plan their curricula avoiding issues which conflict with their religious principles.

So what is it?
I grew up in a NE coalmining, ship building town and am a dyed-in- the wool socialist. As I grew up the LP managed to repair all those basic inequalities but never overcame the traditional class system, landowning system, which is the cause of most of the inequalities we see now.
ie the attitude of "we don't have to keep the laws that they do">

Who ever said thst all Jewish people spoke with one voice about any semitism?
Again, trying to simplify complex situations .

Some posters seem to have the idea that the more left wing have condemned Starmer from the start, the fact is that most were prepared to give him a chance to implement the necessary measures. Unfortunately he has consistently failed to deliver his promises. He said the LP was a broad church, it isn't any longer.

You’re right of course maddyone. I wasn’t actually referring to not agreeing with me, but not acknowledging what lots of other posters have to say because it doesn’t fit with the left wing rhetoric, but I can see what you mean and I’m sorry, I didn’t phrase it well at all.

Casdon

As I said, there’s no reasoning with some people.

Not a very nice comment. Why should people agree with you just because you think you can persuade them to agree with you. People are entitled to their own opinions.

Casdon I voted for Keir Starmer in the leadership election, of course I was supportive at first. I believed what he said to get elected . He has just been so dissapointing. More fool me I suppose.

I’ve never been a member of any political party and Keir Starmer would not inspire me to join the Labour Party. Mind you, I don’t think any politician will ever inspire me to join any political party.

It is commonly accepted that Jews spoke with one voice about antisemitism in the LP. This is an account that shows they did not www.thejc.com/comment/opinion/among-charedim-jeremy-corbyn-s-defeat-is-not-being-celebrated-at-all-1.494545

‘People’were not willing to support Starmer trisher, nobody was going to measure up to their hero, and Starmer was not in their top choices for the replacement either. Dissent was there from the beginning.
I agree Iam64. It’s smoke and mirrors.

The anti semitism/Jews in the Labour Party/Palestine is more complex than some posters will ever acknowledge

Thank you trisher.

Kali2

Jews in Labour Party who support Palestine. Could you please give more information on this?

jwa.org/blog/weaponization-antisemitism-naomi-wimborne-idrissis-suspension-uk-labour-party

The people who dislike and distrust Keir Starmer are not actually doing him any harm though because they do not have a place in the mainstream media.
They are though a convenient scapegoat when Keir Starmer is not proving to be as popular as he thought he would be. The left wing is blamed for being "disruptive" and if only everyone would get behind the elected leader he would be more successful.
I don't think that his party would be worse than the Conservatives but I don't think it would be very different in tone. Rachel Reeves still talks about "magic money trees" and both she and Keir Starmer welcomed with open arms a man who voted against free school meals for children.

Lots of people like myself have left the party and Rachel Reeves says she is glad about that because we don't share her values. Well if her values include taking free school dinners away from children then she is correct, I don't share them.

Having said that of course I have "nowhere else to go" and until there is I will probably continue to vote Labour. Not least because of Andy Burnham and the Manchester labour Council who I think are doing a good job.

MaizieD

trisher

So did he not promise to "unite" the party? I've yet to see any definition of unite which means just getting rid of one lot of people.
Isn't it controlling to decide what people are allowed to think or say?
Even Tony Blair didn't try to rid the LP of its left wing supporters and some of those were far to the left of today's people

Hadn't Neil Kinnock done that before Blair won the leadership of the LP? Militant Tendency?

But Neil Kinnock didn't actually expel member of Militant or the extreme left. Some Militant members were expelled by local parties. But Militant had been putting its own candidates up as MPs. Eventually Militant chose to leave the party and became independent. There were though some people remaining who would be considered far to the left of those described as far-left today. When Tony Blair managed to change Clause 4 there were still people in the party who believed in it. There have always been left wing party members.
Guess who said this in 2017
“We’re a broad church and we should remain a broad church,” he says. “It is one of the great strengths of the party that it’s a broad church. It has allowed the party to change over time and to remain relevant over the very many years of its history.

“It started off as a narrowly-based party of the trade unions and working people as its primary function. Then it broadened and embraced all sorts of other important social issues – including all the work that’s been done recently in relation to equality and sexuality, then into climate change and environmental protection. That broad church is important because it allows us to be a broad-based party that’s representing a broad swathe of people across Britain, but also because it gives us the flexibility to be the party of the future as well as the party of the past.”

Jews in Labour Party who support Palestine. Could you please give more information on this?

Casdon

trisher if I remember rightly to unite, people have to meet in the middle. Since Corbyn went, I see absolutely no sign of the left displaying any willingness to compromise. Instead it’s sour grapes, malicious rumours and downright lies all the way. Most people see the campaign that’s being mounted for what it is.
And yes, MaizieD Neil Kinnock did, and got a very rough ride as a result. Deja vu anybody?

People were willing to back Starmer but Starmer is throwing the left out of the party including the Jews who support Palestine

So Starmer said he would unite but is not he's doing the opposite

Iam I fear you are right.

My fear is that starmer will have no option but to Get rid of the momentum/militant group who don’t want a labour govt. they want a revolution - which won’t happen. So Starmer does a kinnock, making way for a leader who is in a stronger position to unite the party
It’s no good blaming Starmer for the disruptive
Behaviour of a small but noisy group

I can’t see how any party could be worse than what we have

I think a fundamental question is whether the Labour Party has a natural voter base given that the traditional working class numbers have been reducing since before WW2 and not all of them voted Labour. It seems to me that Starmer has the classic problem of holding together a party prone to splits as did Harold Wilson. It is only in recent times that the Tories have experienced this because of the EU (to John Major's discomfort) and it will be interesting to see whether now the Brexit mistake has happened it will continue to find reasons to split.

''Starmer is a hypocrite, a liar and wants to control people.''

not bitter did you say Grany?

The Labour left will continue to be un-electable.

That is not an issue per se - but it does mean that if the Labour extreme left scuppers the Labour Party- we will have the Tories again, and again- however dire, rotten, perverse and worse, they have recently been proven to be (not all Cons- but those in charge, and those who support them).

trisher if I remember rightly to unite, people have to meet in the middle. Since Corbyn went, I see absolutely no sign of the left displaying any willingness to compromise. Instead it’s sour grapes, malicious rumours and downright lies all the way. Most people see the campaign that’s being mounted for what it is.
And yes, MaizieD Neil Kinnock did, and got a very rough ride as a result. Deja vu anybody?