Deliberate and orchestrated silencing of trans rights supporters on GN

It's the process of silencing VS.

Asking a question.
Demanding an answer.
Being angry when the answer isn't what was wanted.

How about listening to answers, evaluating them and still disagreeing?
Not silencing, no manipulative agenda, just plain, simple disagreement?

Ye gods.

From the Telegraph this morning:

“MEN are being asked if they are pregnant before undergoing scans at NHS trusts in England, it has emerged.

Male cancer patients and those having X-rays and MRI scans are being asked if they could be expecting a baby after the Government removed the word “female” from the law governing the medical procedures and replaced it with “individuals”.

The Walton Centre NHS Foundation Trust, in Liverpool, now asks “all patients under the age of 60, regardless of how you may identify your gender”.

This is some crazy world we live in now.
PC gone absolutely bonkers.
Let’s pester the 99% of patients eh with this nonsense whilst pandering to the infinitesimal number it might be relevant to - who could likely fit on the head of a pin.

yes, I saw this, how ridiculous

Lol, I'd like to be a fly on the wall if any of the originally biological males, when asked this question, reply that, yes, they could be...

Wonder what would happen then??

Of course, that is a possibility. But it depends on the spirit in which it's happening and with who. For some on here, it's a pattern which has unfortunately been repeated many times.

Disagreeing is fine. But using statements like 'twist words', 'you never' is hostile and just looking for an argument.

We don't agree. Fine! That is life. Being rude because someone disagrees with you isn't fine.

GagaJo

It's the process of silencing VS.

Asking a question.
Demanding an answer.
Being angry when the answer isn't what was wanted.

Asking questions is how debate works. Having those questions ignored is frustrating, and repeating them is not ‘demanding’ answers. Refusing to answer suggests that there is no comeback to what has been asked.

Debates like this are very simple in form. Some people believe that transwomen are women, and others don’t. Everything else follows from that. Those beliefs hinge on an understanding of what a woman is, and debate is impossible unless both ‘sides’ make their position on that clear. There is a constant refusal to answer that question with anything other than a meaningless comment that is not explained (eg a woman is what I say it is/a social construct/someone who says they are a woman). Those definitions don’t move the debate on at all, so of course people press for (not ‘demand’ answers). If there is no requirement to answer questions how can there be debate?

Popping up in a discussion to throw insults or make snide remarks but refusing to answer questions is not debate. Shouting in capitals that others are DEMANDING answers is not debate. Playing the ‘Poor me, everyone picks on me’ card is not debate, and nor is twisting words or getting comments cancelled when you don’t like them. All of those things are ‘silencing’ in my opinion.

None of those things have happened on this thread, which is why it has remained civil. Perhaps that could continue?

We are still no nearer to knowing what you think a woman is GagaJo. Saying that it is ‘a social construct’ doesn’t help us to understand how people know that they are one, or what it is that they know they are not.

Urmstongran

Ye gods.

From the Telegraph this morning:

“MEN are being asked if they are pregnant before undergoing scans at NHS trusts in England, it has emerged.

Male cancer patients and those having X-rays and MRI scans are being asked if they could be expecting a baby after the Government removed the word “female” from the law governing the medical procedures and replaced it with “individuals”.

The Walton Centre NHS Foundation Trust, in Liverpool, now asks “all patients under the age of 60, regardless of how you may identify your gender”.

This is some crazy world we live in now.
PC gone absolutely bonkers.
Let’s pester the 99% of patients eh with this nonsense whilst pandering to the infinitesimal number it might be relevant to - who could likely fit on the head of a pin.

It would show up the ridiculousness of it all if every male were to answer "I don't know is there a way to tell?" Bet the staff would be quick to point out that a penis and testicles rules out that possibility. This has gone beyond the tail wagging the dog!

I just feel sorry for all those patients who are already scared & upset with their cancer diagnosis. Going for a scan at times like this it beggars belief that this PC nonsense is directed at them. No wonder the majority of us roll our eyes.

Actually sorry everyone. My post isn’t relevant really on this thread. Ignore me.

It doesn't matter 'how you may identify your gender'. It is your sex that determines whether or not you might be pregnant.

I find this assumption that transpeople have erased all memory of who they were throughout their formative years quite insulting. Surely there is no suggestion that 'identifying as another gender' affects their cognitive ability?

So, a message to all those "disgusted of Tunbridge Wells" posters this morning.

Its a universal form that is used by everyone.

You are being manipulated.

I was asked if I might be pregnant, or was trying to conceive when I had my last Covid jab. Maybe I would have been flattered, had the nurse not snorted and pointed out that she had to ask ?

I'm not being manipulated. I can see what it's for, but can also see that words matter, and the more commonplace this sort of thing becomes the easier it is to slip other nonsense under the wire - that's how propaganda works.

Your post is relevant Urmstongtan and I agree with it. It's hardly going to help a patient feel confident in the treatment they are receiving, and have confidence in the person delivering that treatment if they are clearly a man, and are asked if they could be pregnant.

Would you want a clinician treating you, asking if you were a man, if you could be pregnant? I certainly wouldn't; good grief it's basic biology.

Exactly Doodledog.

There is an indignant article in the Torygraph that leaves out half the story, and doesn't highlight that there is one form to fill in for everybody regardless of their sex/gender. Becuase having one form saves time and money, and prevents mistakes. And its been that way forever, mainly.

But no, its PC gone mad and of course you're not being manipulated to think society has gone bonkers.

I think you'll find that's how propaganda works.

I have been in for 6 scans over the last few years for prostate problems. Never been asked if I was pregnant, but if I was asked, I would say “what do you think”. I feel sorry for the nurses having to ask these sort of questions. Most men of my age will be totally bemused that it is being asked. I know I was being scanned for cancer (along with biopsies). It seems crazy to me that people are having to ask this sort of nonsense so they don’t get sued.

When is the ludicrous bending over backwards to appease people who ID as a woman/man when they are man/woman, when every cell in their body identifies them as the sex they were born.

The NHS is under enough pressure, enough is enough.

Smileless2012

Your post is relevant Urmstongtan and I agree with it. It's hardly going to help a patient feel confident in the treatment they are receiving, and have confidence in the person delivering that treatment if they are clearly a man, and are asked if they could be pregnant.

Would you want a clinician treating you, asking if you were a man, if you could be pregnant? I certainly wouldn't; good grief it's basic biology.

Exactly Doodledog.

It would certainly lower your faith in their medical capabilities if a DR . asked you if you were male or female when you were lying there practically nude flashing your anatomy for all the world to see.

I did promise myself to stay off the trans threads and this is why. It's like the M&H Starting Gate.

We'll have no facts here, just umbrage, thank you.

But no, its PC gone mad and of course you're not being manipulated to think society has gone bonkers. I think you'll find that's how propaganda works.

I don't think PC has gone mad, and nor am I being manipulated. You'll need a more sophisticated analysis of audience segmentation (and a tone of voice that is less condescending) if you want to understand how propaganda works.

Volver is right. There is one form for everyone. The Telegraph have created a story where there is none.
We need to stop being divided by this nonsense and focus on the real matters in hand.

There will be one generic form for everyone, but they don't ask everyone every question on the form. Just like the blood test request form, the boxes that are relevant are ticked. those not relevant left blank.
Personal experience of recent-ish mri scans, chemo and radiotherapy, I wasn't once asked if I could be pregnant, nor did anyone ask about my possible prostate. As a post menopausal women maybe they used common sense.

*woman, there's only one of me.

You'll need a more sophisticated analysis of audience segmentation

I'm going to suppose that the Telegraph have got their segmentation about right; Mainly right-leaning voters of an older age demographic who are worried about the erosion of what they see as traditional values in society.

Sorry, was that condescending? I tend to be when I'm talking about something I know about and someone else tries to belittle me.

The Daily Mail are running the same divisive trumped up tale.