So ... no more fines for Boris!

Eloethan

So it is reported that junior civil servants at the "work event" were fined but senior civil servants and the PM were not. How does that work then?

Did the rules really mean that if you worked in a particular place you were entitled to have a social event, with drinks, either during or at the end of the business day?

DH did read that it depended on what level of legal advice you could afford ( but I need to check out where he read it…..)

If they can't even abide by the rules they have made and that they stood by and watched other people being punished for allegedly breaking, how can they be seen as fit to run the country?

So it is reported that junior civil servants at the "work event" were fined but senior civil servants and the PM were not. How does that work then?

Did the rules really mean that if you worked in a particular place you were entitled to have a social event, with drinks, either during or at the end of the business day?

Most Tory MPs seem to be supporting Johnson (probably with their fingers crossed) and putting Party before country. But, it seems to me that one or two backbenchers aren’t quite toeing the party line. Jeremy Hunt has been more sympathetic to the cost of living situation and so has Ian DS. Are they playing a long game and preparing for the inevitable leadership contest? But where is Gove? I know he is a backstabber but according to a close family member who knows about these things, he gets things done. Obviously all three of these people are pretty grim but there’s no one in the current cabinet who has the sense, brains or dignity to be PM. I may have wandered off the point…

Thanks to those at the top of government, this country is turning into the sort of banana republic we used to laugh at.

Lies, sleaze and corruption is the new "normal" ?

Well what a surprise.
www.itv.com/news/2022-05-23/pm-urged-to-explain-secret-meeting-as-partygate-report-set-to-be-published

No it isn’t normal. But it’s become normal. And that’s terrifying.

?

Tom London
@TomLondon

For younger readers:
What is happening in UK now is NOT NORMAL

I was born in 1961. Never have I seen such a serious threat to the Rule of Law, standards in public life, human rights & democracy itself as the threat from Johnson’s Govt

I dont care anymore about partygate beergate or any other gate it's time our politicians of all parties grew up and started running the country

paddyann54

According to a clipping I read on an article last night Boris KNEW in April that he was to expect ONE fine .He told the man who wrote the article!!Now either he has a chrystal ball or he really does have the MET in his back pocket .
I know which I believe .

Yes I read that.

Corruption

JenniferEccles Do we take the delivery driver's estimate of how many were at Starmer's gathering as incontravertable evidence then? I wonder which reporter(s|) located and quizzed him. Would anyone have paid much attention, or offered any inducement, just for him to confirm that 9 or fewer people were in attendance. And no Johnson supporters would be drawing attention to it.

According to a clipping I read on an article last night Boris KNEW in April that he was to expect ONE fine .He told the man who wrote the article!!Now either he has a chrystal ball or he really does have the MET in his back pocket .
I know which I believe .

Partygate is just one in a long line of lies by Johnson, remember the bus? £325m for the NHS? That never existed. Remember the oven ready Brexit deal with its benefits for all? That never existed either. Starmer is a dead cat strategy, something to deflect the attention away from him and put some mud on someone else, Johnson lied in Parliament, Starmer didn't

Johnson says whatever will get him through the next ten minutes

CatsCatsCats

But on HIGNFY last night it turns out that Keir Starmer has lied, too.

He said there were only 6 (or was it 9?) people attending beergate, but it turns out there were 15 people as has been evidenced by documents.

So why is a lie told by BJ worse than any told by Starmer?

All politicians lie - it goes with the job. Call me cynical but they must have lied somewhere along the line to get to the positions they hold.

That isn’t correct.

Maremia

Not sure what you mean by the 'biggest crime' Katie59. Our Prime Minister lied to us and to Parliament. If he had confessed and apologised before the investigation, he would have saved us the £500k. This 'waste of money' is all on him.

Exactly, the penalty was a “small” fine, be honest say sorry and take the penalty, don’t try to lie your way out of it. This is what we teach our children to do “don’t lie” - or at least should do.

It should not have cost £500m, why do they do it, they work in the public eye where lies are easily exposed, there is no chance of getting away with it

If they had to pay the cost of the investigation or damage done they would be more honest

I will be shocked if the Durham police find Keir Starmer guilty of breaking lockdown rules.

But , sorry to say , I have been shocked by many things affecting our politics, which should never have happened, but did.

CatsCatsCats

Volver - I don't think anyone's head should come off over such a silly thing. I just can't get my head round why people think a lie somehow differs in magnitude. A lie is a lie is a lie.

Petera My conviction that all politicians lie, it's part of the job, came long, long before Johnson and Starmer came on the scene.

Jennifer Eccles To be honest I am far more irritated by Starmer after his incessant sanctimonious ranting at the PM only to be caught doing the same thing. I couldn't agree more.

Yes, a lie is a lie. And some politicians on both sides of the House indulge in them.

Starmer had no option other than to offer his resignation if Durham Police decide, after re-opening their investigation, to give him a fixed-penalty notice. He has to practise what he preaches - obviously.

An "unknown source" (always a reliable wellspring of information ) who was present at the Labour office stated that to the "best of his knowledge" Starmer did not return to work after the (legal at the time) work gathering. Photo's show some people eating standing up - people were going in and out of the kitchen collecting food and then, supposedly, getting on with their work. The police will decide.

Starmer acknowledged the meal took place. Johnson spent months denying that Nr 10 parties even took place. The Met investigation proved that he had been lying. Further, a minister has said (alleged) that Johnson had told him he had no intention of resigning and that it would need a "flame thrower" to get him out of office.

Strangely enough, a higher proportion of Labour supporters / activists think Starmer should resign, than their Conservative counterparts. This was the result of a poll - but I can't find it now. Starmer has a lot of enemies in the Labour movement.

The bottom line is that it shouldn't be a novel concept that ministers or party leaders should not break the criminal law and remain in office if they do. Every PM authorises and pledges to follow the ministerial code.

CatsCatsCats, Who is our Prime Minister, Boris Johnson or Keir Starmer? Who lied to Parliament?

There was no beergate and if there was only 6 went (lie that undermines everything he says).

The only lies that are right are those that are to prevent hurting somebody's feelings, i.e. white lies.

Both Boris and Starmer lied to cover up what they'd did. Both of them.

Volver - I don't think anyone's head should come off over such a silly thing. I just can't get my head round why people think a lie somehow differs in magnitude. A lie is a lie is a lie.

I am having sausage rolls for my lunch (lie that doesn't matter to anybody.)

There were no parties and obviously I didn't go to them, Mr Speaker. (lie that undermines democracy)

That's the difference.

Volver - I don't think anyone's head should come off over such a silly thing. I just can't get my head round why people think a lie somehow differs in magnitude. A lie is a lie is a lie.

Petera My conviction that all politicians lie, it's part of the job, came long, long before Johnson and Starmer came on the scene.

Jennifer Eccles To be honest I am far more irritated by Starmer after his incessant sanctimonious ranting at the PM only to be caught doing the same thing. I couldn't agree more.

TBH, it's immaterial whether there were 6 or 60 people present. It was either a 'party', not permitted, or a work meeting (specifically allowed under the rules for political campaigning).

The truth of it is for the police to decide now, not the Daily Mail or HIGNFY.

CatsCatsCats HIGFNY is satirical panel show. While I enjoy reading Private Eye and applaud its journalists for all the investigative work they do, please don't forget, as Hislop often says tongue-in-cheek, HIGNFY has to be balanced. They poke fun at both sides.

You are very wrong if you believe that anything Starmer has said about one gathering after a day of campaigning is even on the same scale as the fraud that Johnson has perpetrated on the electorate via Vote Leave, the 2019 General Election and the continuing travesty of the Brexit he engineered.

Voters cannot make make fair judgements on the basis of falsehoods. Political lying is a form of theft.

According to the delivery driver who took the curries to Starmer and co. in Durham, there were about 30 people there.
The driver then appeared to have been ‘got at’ by his manager and then it was said the driver ‘couldn’t remember’

To be honest I am far more irritated by Starmer after his incessant sanctimonious ranting at the PM only to be caught doing the same thing.

It’s this hypocrisy which people find the most galling.

CatsCatsCats All politicians lie - it goes with the job. Call me cynical but they must have lied somewhere along the line to get to the positions they hold.

This is one of the worst long-term effects of Johnson; he somehow manages to reduce everyone else, in the eyes of the public, to his level.