The U.K. 2022

MaizieD I have missed Granys post, do you think that the sum of £2.5 billion is just for temporary privatisation of the utilities (water, gas & electric) until the crises ease, as opposed to a permanent nationalisation?

GrannyGravy13

Whitewavemark2

Tory voters agreeing with Gordon Brown

“More than two-thirds of Conservative voters say that the government should temporarily renationalise energy companies if they cannot offer lower bills”

Has the so called temporary privatisation been costed?

Grany posted somewhere that the TUC have costed renationalisation at £2.5 billion. It seems a bit low to me.

There's an interesting article about the privatisation of water in the Guardian yesterday. By Jonathon Portes, an economist who actually worked on it at the time.

So how did we get it so wrong? I mean me, not you. I was a very junior Treasury official working on the water privatisation project, responsible for securing value for money for taxpayers and water consumers. In retrospect, we utterly failed on both counts: the shares were sold well below their value so taxpayers lost out, and consumers have paid through the nose ever since. But this is not just hindsight. We knew what was going on, because water privatisation was never really about efficiency. In the short term, the overriding political priority was a “successful” sale – one where demand for shares was high – and where those who applied and who had, from previous privatisations, already come to expect a large premium, were not disappointed.

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2022/aug/16/i-worked-on-privatisation-england-water-1989-failed-regime

Why are there only illegal routes into this country for asylum seekers, they take these routes out of desperation. You only have to look at the mess made by the government with people for Afghanistan

GrannyGravy13

Whitewavemark2

Tory voters agreeing with Gordon Brown

“More than two-thirds of Conservative voters say that the government should temporarily renationalise energy companies if they cannot offer lower bills”

Has the so called temporary privatisation been costed?

I’m not sure, but it won’t cost as much as the £37bn the Tories gave away for b…….r all to their crony.

That has been deemed illegal and yet no one is answerable it seems.

Disgusting.

Sorry nationalisation not privatisiation

Whitewavemark2

Tory voters agreeing with Gordon Brown

“More than two-thirds of Conservative voters say that the government should temporarily renationalise energy companies if they cannot offer lower bills”

Has the so called temporary privatisation been costed?

Fleurpepper

You are joking, of course!?!

Blair certainly was no socialist.

Katie59

Whitewavemark2

Tory voters agreeing with Gordon Brown

“More than two-thirds of Conservative voters say that the government should temporarily renationalise energy companies if they cannot offer lower bills”

No real surprises there Blair was a pretty good Tory PM , until it all went wrong.

? Brown not Blair

Well Katie I am no apologist for Blair but I have not seen any Tory PMs reduce child poverty by a million during their term of office.

You are joking, of course!?!

Whitewavemark2

Tory voters agreeing with Gordon Brown

“More than two-thirds of Conservative voters say that the government should temporarily renationalise energy companies if they cannot offer lower bills”

No real surprises there Blair was a pretty good Tory PM , until it all went wrong.

Tory voters agreeing with Gordon Brown

“More than two-thirds of Conservative voters say that the government should temporarily renationalise energy companies if they cannot offer lower bills”

Whitewavemark2

The immorality of this government is breath taking

BBC

“UK ministers who backed sending asylum seekers to Rwanda were warned by their own adviser that its government tortures and kills political opponents.”

I also see that Patel is trying to keep the Rwanda report secret.

Something to hide?

Truss talking down the British worker by saying that they lack “graft” is hardly going to attract new business is it!

What a fool that woman is.

It's all repeating what has been done before, sadly.

When did this happen?

Take a group who are already suffering from some prejudice.

Make sure they are identifiable with some sort of catchy term.

Lie about them and make sure people see them as the source of many of our ills.

Paint them as sub-human or certainly not like "us"/don't behave like "us".

Change your country's laws to take away their rights.

Ship them off to another country. Then you don't have to think about whether they live or die.

The immorality of this government is breath taking

BBC

“UK ministers who backed sending asylum seekers to Rwanda were warned by their own adviser that its government tortures and kills political opponents.”

MayBee70

DaisyAnne

I was thinking this morning, Whitewave, that many people don't seem to realise that Labour's job, at the moment, is to apply political pressure while offering a plan they would be prepared to carry out now.

My wandering train of thought told me that we get much more of a plan before a General Election. I then remembered the Tory manifesto brought out before the last election. It said so little. It seems they gave us exactly what they promised.

I think one of the few things they followed through from their manifestos in recent years was the EU referendum. Unfortunately

What a devastating outcome that is proving to be.

We are becoming the sick man of Europe again.

DaisyAnne

I was thinking this morning, Whitewave, that many people don't seem to realise that Labour's job, at the moment, is to apply political pressure while offering a plan they would be prepared to carry out now.

My wandering train of thought told me that we get much more of a plan before a General Election. I then remembered the Tory manifesto brought out before the last election. It said so little. It seems they gave us exactly what they promised.

I think one of the few things they followed through from their manifestos in recent years was the EU referendum. Unfortunately

I expect I’m wasting my time, but for all those of you who are complaining about illegal routes into the UK, too many refugees here etc etc, please watch this speech from the recent Lords’ debate on the issue:

youtu.be/Af34YNSnMe0

Tweet

“I'm a trustee of a charity whose electricity bill will rise from
£8k in 2019
to
£50k in 2023.

We're screwed.
This country, I mean.

You know what this means for businesses, charities, homeowners, industry, hospitals, schools?

Everything will collapse.”

I was thinking this morning, Whitewave, that many people don't seem to realise that Labour's job, at the moment, is to apply political pressure while offering a plan they would be prepared to carry out now.

My wandering train of thought told me that we get much more of a plan before a General Election. I then remembered the Tory manifesto brought out before the last election. It said so little. It seems they gave us exactly what they promised.

Grany

I agree with an energy price cap freeze

But I think Starmer's wrong to say propping up the Big 5 energy suppliers is better than taking them into public ownership

@The_TUC
estimates nationalising would cost £2.85bn. Clearly more cost effective & sensible

What Starmer is trying to achieve at this point in time is to use the money to support those in energy crises.

Putting the money into nationalising the energy companies at this point would do nothing to help the poor, disabled and pensioners.

He has done it across the board in order to at the same time tackle inflation.

This is a holding pattern to get us over winter.

The Labour Party would then look at what needs to be done once the initial problem is fixed.

But don’t forget that they aren’t in power, the best that can happen is that they put pressure on this absent government. It worked with the windfall tax, which the Tories initially rubbished, but have now adopted, so let’s hope this plan also nudges them in the right direction.

Grany

I agree with an energy price cap freeze

But I think Starmer's wrong to say propping up the Big 5 energy suppliers is better than taking them into public ownership

@The_TUC
estimates nationalising would cost £2.85bn. Clearly more cost effective & sensible

The Labour Plan addresses the immediate problems Grany. It may be flawed. However, that will not be because it doesn't suggest the nationalisation of the energy distributors.

The "Big 5" energy distributors are not the problem. The wholesale market is where the issue lies. Within that market, it is mainly gas that is increasing the price. One of the biggest suppliers to that market is Russia. I am sure Keir Starmer and the rest of the Labour Party team working on this would be ecstatic to hear your solution to that problem.

Don't misunderstand me. I am open to being convinced about nationalisation. However, if we are going to bring it in it has to be a studied and worthwhile plan - not just a mantra of the far-left.

Gabrielle56

Iam64

Adeline it’s a relief to see it’s clear I’m not the only poster who sees the racism and total absence of either compassion or understanding about the desperate souls in rubber boats

I wish this country could encourage our hone grown medics and those who returned to other parts of Europe where pay and conditions are better and they’re welcomed

Those in rubber boats as you put it are not refugees fleeing they're paying passengers! They appear to have the impression from somewhere (Netflix/films/TV/our own publicity) that UK is LONDON in a nutshell- were our own worst enemy! We depict UK as a land of plenty/riches/glamour/success and fail to also show the sink estates /non existent housing /groaning health system/homeless already living on streets everywhere in UK. Many have come here and been shocked at their fates, thinking they would be given a home a job money etc etc immediately because that's what the publicity says! Disillusioned they've stuck here! Spent all their money or put themselves in hock to traffickers to get here only to discover were not like Mary Poppinsville AT ALL! This needs serious tackling by serious minds, not unqualified bigheads er.. I mean politicians

That is not the truth. It sounds far too much like the Nazification going on in this country. I wonder where you got it from?

From Full Fact dated 4 April 2022:

There is no evidence for this. Research carried out by the Refugee Council shows the majority of nationals from the countries most represented in small boat arrivals are granted asylum. The Home Office doesn’t publish statistics covering asylum claims following small boat arrivals specifically.

fullfact.org/immigration/scott-benton-small-boats-economic-migrants/#actions There is more information about what action Full Fact took as a result of this fact check.

Lies - the above post is not the truth, do not help resolve problems. This government and those in the world of smearing and labelling do not solve problems. They pretend they exist where they do not. This, as is the intention, distracts from the real problems this government has brought on us. That is exactly what taking this thread off topic was intended to do and sadly has achieved.

I agree with an energy price cap freeze

But I think Starmer's wrong to say propping up the Big 5 energy suppliers is better than taking them into public ownership

@The_TUC
estimates nationalising would cost £2.85bn. Clearly more cost effective & sensible