So, who votes for a government that improves the lives of Bankers, and ensures the excessive profits of energy companies, but needs all the "levelling up" money to pay for the holes in Brexit?

I should amend that to ‘happy people’.

Happiness seems to wind you up volver doesn’t it?

And so say all of us, Mr Cratchit.

I’m not rich. (actually I’m running an overdraft at present).
That said, I’m not jealous of people who are.
Maybe that because I’m a happy person.
Or I have different ‘riches’ to be thankful for.
?

Germanshepherdsmum

I can see with my own eyes who is being blamed, volver. I have no chip on my shoulder but it’s abundantly clear that there are those who do.

Not everyone who has money, who is a high earner, is driven by a love of money.

No GSM, you're right there.

But you have to wonder about those who constantly think they are being picked on.

This thread is full of suggested solutions. Far more than I personally could come up with, and better thought out than anything I would have come up with.

Yet, you still tell us that we're blaming the wealthy. I don't have any sympathy for that viewpoint, sorry

I can see with my own eyes who is being blamed, volver. I have no chip on my shoulder but it’s abundantly clear that there are those who do.

Not everyone who has money, who is a high earner, is driven by a love of money.

Since 2001, Norway has had "pay transparency," which means any citizen can go online and see another citizen's salary (and how much they paid in taxes. This began as a way to increase people's trust in the tax and social-security system.
This is what we should do in the U.K. We might then end up with fairer wages and shame those who have enormous bonuses and dodge paying their taxes.

volver

No. There are three threads running on GN N&P that you think are blaming the wealthy for all the ills in society because there are certain people with money who have chips on their shoulders and think everyone is blaming them. And seem to have no understanding of what an equitable society means or that it isn't love of money that drives most of us.

All those rich people, we don't give them a chance and we're nasty, jealous oiks, aren't we?

Haven’t seen any jealous oiks volver just posters playing the blame game without offering any solutions.

No. There are three threads running on GN N&P that you think are blaming the wealthy for all the ills in society because there are certain people with money who have chips on their shoulders and think everyone is blaming them. And seem to have no understanding of what an equitable society means or that it isn't love of money that drives most of us.

All those rich people, we don't give them a chance and we're nasty, jealous oiks, aren't we?

All the usual suspects, GG. Those who don’t have it always blame those who do.

Germanshepherdsmum

What difference does it make to anyone but the bankers Grantanow? Do you think that the bonus money would magically be given to the poor instead? It’s not going to happen. There is an inherent dislike of people who have money in this country. Anyone who earns a high salary is called a fat cat. Jealousy, pure and simple.

There are now three current threads on GN N&P blaming the wealthy for all the ills in society?

What difference does it make to anyone but the bankers Grantanow? Do you think that the bonus money would magically be given to the poor instead? It’s not going to happen. There is an inherent dislike of people who have money in this country. Anyone who earns a high salary is called a fat cat. Jealousy, pure and simple.

Worked in all sorts of jobs since I was 14 ! New 72 still paying tax , never received a bonus ever!!!! Never voted Tory EVER!!!!

In answer to the initial question, 'Bankers, of course, and other fat cats!'. When we were pre-Brexit the EU tried to restrain bankers' bonuses by capping them across Europe including the UK. The City banks simply increased bankers' basic salaries to compensate for limited bonuses. Now we are post-Brexit the Tories can lift the bonus cap so bankers benefit from augmented salaries and unlimited bonuses. It's disgusting when so many people are visiting food banks and worried sick about their bills.

Lose, not use.

Gabrielle

I think you mean investment banking, which has been fully separated from retail banking - no ‘haha’ about it. As regards money laundering, I have worked with the very tight money laundering regulations and perhaps knows a little more about them and their enforcement than you do. Don’t believe all you read in the sensationalist press or on social media.

Non-cash bonuses - share options - are not what everyone wants. Bank share prices have been in the doldrums for a good few years. If I were a banker offered share options I would rather have the cash today and pay the tax and NI.

Whilst not germane to the present discussion, to answer your point - the reason that high street banks are disappearing is that not enough people now use them to make them viable. Our local town will shortly use its last one and I fully understand why - I have never set foot in it nor used it’s cash point in all the years I’ve lived here - I bank online and use the PO for cash or paying in the occasional cheque instead.

Non cash bonuses will probably circumvent a lot of tax revenue. Corporate banking is not tied up with high street(ha ha!) Banking do were not put at risk as before the crash. However, do we really want to continue to be known globally as the world's launderette for filthy money?! Because THAT is the way we're viewed at moments. We are tangled up with organised crime money so badly it could be impossible to survive without it! Another gripe- can we have back some high street banks, and stop the push to make cash obsolete? Just a thought.....

Keffie, do you think that somehow if the cap remained there would be money available for other people to share instead of being given to bankers?

spabbygirl

bankers don't pay full tax, there are many ways to dodge tax, like putting money in the Cayman Islands, thats why people are so cross with the tories, if they paid full tax we wouldn't have a skint nhs

Bankers pay tax through PAYE spabbygirl, like any other employee. Tax taken at source.

Tuskanini

The bonus cap is being removed because it didn't work. Banks just raised the basic salaries.

Not correct. Yes their basic salary has been raised. But threre are serious issues with removing the cap

bankers don't pay full tax, there are many ways to dodge tax, like putting money in the Cayman Islands, thats why people are so cross with the tories, if they paid full tax we wouldn't have a skint nhs

The only Brexit benefits ever were for the bankers and elite. They weren't ever going to be for us.

As for AP who said the cap should be removed it is clear to me you are in a position of having alot of money to say such a thing.

That's why I and millions of us through ex-pats and The U K fought for the 2nd referendum. Thanks to Jo Swinson it didn't happen, however that's another story.

That's why we are quietly beavering in the background (the remain alliances) are now rejoin. It won't happen overnight however it will happen. It's a 10 year minimum project

The bonus cap is being removed because it didn't work. Banks just raised the basic salaries.

Taxing bonus shares

The following is taken from an article written for Bytestart which is a small information business site.

"The gift of shares in recognition of an employee’s performance or long service will generally be taxable in the employee’s hands as employment income. Since there is no market for most shares in private companies, the employee will need to declare this income under self-assessment, not PAYE. There should, however, be no national insurance contributions on the gift.

The income tax liability will be based on the value of the shares. A minority holding in a private company will usually be heavily discounted and is not simply a fraction of the price of the company. The value will need to be agreed with HMRC.

The company’s accountants may be able to do this, or it may necessary to employ a specialist valuer. Consideration will need to be given to the restricted securities regime if there are restrictions on the shares. It is possible to opt out of this regime.

The company can meet any tax liability on behalf of the employee; however this will give rise to PAYE and NIC obligations on the amount of tax.
Taxing share options

An alternative could be to give the employees the right to acquire options over shares in the company. There are several tax efficient share schemes that generally have the advantage of there being no up-front tax.

The most commonly adopted of these are Enterprise Management Incentives. These are relatively cheap to implement and, of particular interest, the company can impose requirements to limit which employees are able to benefit.

In order for the company to qualify, they must meet requirements as to the trade and the size and ownership of the company.

If one of the tax effective schemes is used, when the shares are sold, often there will be no income tax or national insurance on the grant or exercise of the options. When the shares are sold there will be a capital gains tax charge on the employees based on any uplift in value between the price paid and the price achieved on sale.

Capital gains are currently taxed at 20% as opposed to 40/45% for income, so there is a clear attraction for the employees. With no tax upfront, share options are often preferable to more straightforward gifts of shares."