Today’s Mini Budget.

Urmstongran

*German consumer confidence slides further*
Things aren't looking great over in Germany either, where consumer confidence remains on a record downward slide amid soaring inflation and a looming winter energy crisis.

GfK's confidence gauge fell to minus 42.5 points for October, hitting a record low for the fourth month in a row, following a revised September reading of minus 36.8 points.

Rolf Buerkl, GfK consumer expert, said: "The currently very high inflation rates of almost 8pc are leading to large real income losses among consumers and thus to a significant reduction in purchasing power.

"Many households are currently being forced to spend significantly more on energy."

Source: The Telegraph this morning.

It’s not just us.

Germany is suffering the same inflation causing external price rises that the UK is, but apart from that our situations are different, Ug

The UK has other factors affecting its economy, but as complexity is lost on you I really CBA to detail them. Perhaps someone else might have a go.

ug

how much is it costing the German government to borrow compared to the U.K. government.

When you find the answer, ask yourself why.

Has the IMF sent a warning to the German Government over it’s disastrous economic policies?

When you find the answer, ask yourself why?

Is German inflation as high as the UK’s?

When you find the answer ask yourself why

Is the average German household spending as much of its total budget on energy as the average U.K. budget.

When you find the answer ask yourself why.

Has the price of energy in Germany risen at the same level as the UK’s

When you find the answer ask yourself why.

Then come back and say that it is the same in Germany as the U.K.

Urmstongran

Time will tell of course - you may all be right and I’m wrong. But unlike many on here I really do WANT us to do brilliantly and I feel optimistic.

Such gaslighting!

How dare you suggest that you're the only one who wants the country to do well!

Some people are just so blinkered that they can't see reality.

Germany is in a much more difficult position because they face gas disconnections, at least ours is likely to remain connected even if it does cost more.
So far the German government not has made any outlandish policy changes, so recovery will be more certain. Many other countries are in dire straits as well

Hold on Urmstongran. You've dropped your spurtle.

(An instrument used for stirring, for those who didn't know the word.)

I’ve got one of those - for porridge.

Even the most ardent government supporters must surely admit that none of this chaos was foreseen in the so called Truss/Kwarteng plan? The BoE has had to step in to intervene to restore order in the government bond markets.
What major incompetence.

The most ardent government supporters are now saying that the market has been spooked by the prospect of a Labour government (presumably because the LP is now waell ahead in the polls).

So for the last twelve years all of our problems were the fault of the last Labour government but now our problems are the fault of the next Labour government.

I've got a tea towel with a picture of a small child having a tantrum and shouting "it wasnae me!"

There is no confidence that the BoE will be effective yet even though they have stated that they ”will intervene to whatever extent is needed”
The problem is that whenever the speculators smell blood they keep coming back,

Hmm

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“Senior gov't officials warned the PM and the Chancellor that [the Budget] would trigger market volatility and cause a shock to the economy. Officials who advised against Friday’s plans included civil servants in the Treasury and Downing Street, as well as Simon Case.”

Katie59

There is no confidence that the BoE will be effective yet even though they have stated that they ”will intervene to whatever extent is needed”
The problem is that whenever the speculators smell blood they keep coming back,

QE worked to save the pound in the GFC and when it tumbled when the Brexit vote was known. No doubt helping this will work again.

But it had the support of the government on both occasions. Does it have it now?

Because if the markets sniff no support from the govt. I think you might be right about the speculators, Katie59

hoping, not 'helping'...

As the days go by if there is no reassurance from the government regardless of who is the architect of this fiasco it may be Kwarteng’s head that has to go.

varian

The most ardent government supporters are now saying that the market has been spooked by the prospect of a Labour government (presumably because the LP is now waell ahead in the polls).

So for the last twelve years all of our problems were the fault of the last Labour government but now our problems are the fault of the next Labour government.

I've got a tea towel with a picture of a small child having a tantrum and shouting "it wasnae me!"

Now that really is the daftest thing I’ve ever heard! (not your tea towel). Do they think the IQ of the British public is so low that they will swallow it - we are watching the death throes of the Tory Party as we now know it.

Stand by for a bonfire of Public Services, and privatisation of NHS come November, with this huge debt being racked up being used as an excuse. Just watch this space.

Do they think the IQ of the British public is so low that they will swallow it?

Sadly, I think they are arrogant enough to believe it.

Farzanah

Stand by for a bonfire of Public Services, and privatisation of NHS come November, with this huge debt being racked up being used as an excuse. Just watch this space.

Don't fret! The richest 1% can afford whatever they want and don't make much use of the NHS or state schools and don't claim benefits anyway. Oh hang on, what about the police, border control, the army, road builders/maintenance, fire fighters, environmental protection ...?

What about them, eh, growstuff? They're just part of that army of lazy British workers. Let's shock them into putting their noses to the grindstone. ?

MaizieD

What about them, eh, growstuff? They're just part of that army of lazy British workers. Let's shock them into putting their noses to the grindstone. ?

Ah! Yes! "The worst idlers in the world"!

I forgot about the police to arrest the protesting rabbles and the prisons needed to house them. Who's paying for that?

The courts are already at breaking point, so they won't get a trial.

KK acutally worked for that man. Possibly the reason they were laughing their head off at the Queen's funeral

'The hedge fund boss who once employed the chancellor has predicted that sterling will weaken further after his firm bet on the continued fall in the value of the pound.

Crispin Odey is one of at least two prominent Conservative donors who have made fortunes by betting on the pound’s decline. He believes it could reach parity against the US dollar for the first time, or even fall below it.

Kwasi Kwarteng worked at Odey Asset Management, the firm Odey founded, before becoming an MP. The value of the company’s flagship European hedge fund is up about 145 per cent this year.'

From The Times.

Fleurpepper

KK acutally worked for that man. Possibly the reason they were laughing their head off at the Queen's funeral

'The hedge fund boss who once employed the chancellor has predicted that sterling will weaken further after his firm bet on the continued fall in the value of the pound.

Crispin Odey is one of at least two prominent Conservative donors who have made fortunes by betting on the pound’s decline. He believes it could reach parity against the US dollar for the first time, or even fall below it.

Kwasi Kwarteng worked at Odey Asset Management, the firm Odey founded, before becoming an MP. The value of the company’s flagship European hedge fund is up about 145 per cent this year.'

From The Times.

I cant say I'm surprised Fleurpepper at your reporting of the findings, but I still have the naivety to be shocked. Probity in public life indeed.

I work in factory and the people I work with ARE FURIOUS in a blue badge wearing, safe seat, all tory voters even though they are hard working paupers
so I am optimistic no one is going to suck it up...

I still live with hope

Wyllow3

Fleurpepper

KK acutally worked for that man. Possibly the reason they were laughing their head off at the Queen's funeral

'The hedge fund boss who once employed the chancellor has predicted that sterling will weaken further after his firm bet on the continued fall in the value of the pound.

Crispin Odey is one of at least two prominent Conservative donors who have made fortunes by betting on the pound’s decline. He believes it could reach parity against the US dollar for the first time, or even fall below it.

Kwasi Kwarteng worked at Odey Asset Management, the firm Odey founded, before becoming an MP. The value of the company’s flagship European hedge fund is up about 145 per cent this year.'

From The Times.

I cant say I'm surprised Fleurpepper at your reporting of the findings, but I still have the naivety to be shocked. Probity in public life indeed.

And from The Times, not the Guardian or European!

In which case he knew exactly what would happen, no excuses, no way this man should be chancellor.