Voter Identity At Future Elections.

GrannyGravy13

No doubt the Landed Gentry were fairly miffed that women and commoner’s gained the vote back in the day.

Things evolve, always have and always will.

I have absolutely no problem with voter ID, from what I understand from the Gov.U.K. website for those who have no photographic ID they can apply to get one free of charge.

Those of us in England have to show ID in so many instances nowadays, it seems perfectly logical that something as important as voting in elections, whether they be local or national should be the same.

Yes, this.

Enid101

I think it’s about time the whole voting system was overhauled. Using a pencil to mark a cross on a piece of paper in a rickety wooden booth seems rather archaic to me.

TBH I’d much prefer that to any electronic system. which I’m sure could be fiddled by anyone determined enough.
Plus the equipment would be very expensive, so I dare say the number of polling stations would be considerably reduced - probably meaning long queues. My sister in the US has sometimes had to queue for at least an hour. That factor alone would I dare say put a number of people off bothering.

I always think our system is great - just a ten minute walk to the polling station*, no queue, all so civilised, no police standing guard.
Long live the little booth and the stubby pencil!
*yes, I do know everyone doesn’t have one so handy.

I agree Witzend that there is a certain charm to voting as it is now and electronic systems are not foolproof but I do think we should address the fact that too few people vote and this needs to change. If everyone that voted got £10 off their council tax I think the numbers would go up.

Or, we could help people understand that voting is a responsibility and not bribe them to do it?

(86% turnout at the Scottish referendum in 2014, because we knew it was important.)

All adults have the right to vote, with a very few exceptions, so requiring the population to have identification before they are allowed to exercise a basic right to which they are guaranteed access, is not a tenable position.

This is how I feel. Voting is a right.
Other things (such as foreign holidays and driving) are choices.

I find it hard that some people don't seem to care about this fundamental difference.

MaizieD

^Those of us in England have to show ID in so many instances nowadays, it seems perfectly logical that something as important as voting in elections, whether they be local or national should be the same.^

It doesn't seem 'perfectly logical' at all when there is almost zero evidence that the present system doesn't work.

People's unquestioning willingness to accept a move that takes away a basic and rarely abused freedom to exercise our right to vote without any impediment is deeply worrying.

This.

Also, I don't know where some of you live that you are forever having to produce ID, but the ONLY time I have had to provide photo ID in the last couple of years has been when I opened an ISA with a new bank, so it was an anti financial fraud measure which I am obviously perfectly happy with.

Those of you who seem content with this nonsensical and pointless exercise; what about providing some evidence of the voter fraud you seem to think exists?

what about providing some evidence of the voter fraud you seem to think exists?

It's hiding under the bed with the Brexit benefits.

And you don’t have to use a pencil, you can vote using your own pen if you so wish.

Though speaking as a poll clerk, how we are supposed to rub out someone’s pencilled vote after the voting paper has gone into the sealed box beats me.

Do you think the poorer people in the uk are less intelligent than those in other countries that use ID? I am sure that they will be perfectly capable of managing and will be given help if needed.

I have been a poll clerk and vote counter a couple of times,too. It would be quite easy during the counting process after the boxes are emptied. I believe they are going to change things here ,they have finally worked it out. I hope they bring ID s in,too. Probably they will at some stage because they like to collect non voter fines. We have a Premier who is blatantly dishonest so trust is an issue . No one trusts politicians here.

It would be quite easy during the counting process after the boxes are emptied

What would be easy? Rubbing out pencil votes? Destroying voting papers?

I too have counted at elections. In my experience, there are a fair number of you in the same area, it would soon be picked up if you were busy with your rubber. And the papers have to be strictly checked with how many are in the ballot box, so not much chance of getting rid of some.

Yes, am sure the system could be open to corruption if enough staff wanted it, but hopefully the vast majority just want to do their proper job.

The current plan is for photo identification so if you don’t have one you have plenty of time to get one.
Wether it will be implemented is another matter, so is identity of postal voters which is far more open to fraud.

nanna8

I have been a poll clerk and vote counter a couple of times,too. It would be quite easy during the counting process after the boxes are emptied. I believe they are going to change things here ,they have finally worked it out. I hope they bring ID s in,too. Probably they will at some stage because they like to collect non voter fines. We have a Premier who is blatantly dishonest so trust is an issue . No one trusts politicians here.

This is totally irrelevant to the matter of voter ID.

No amount of voter ID would stop your rather wild scenario of the counter getting busy with a rubber... (and how many votes would have to be altered to affect the result?)

We're talking about a person pretending to be another person in order to cast a fraudulent vote. Which is, in itself, a pretty wild scenario. You'd need 100s or 1,000s of impersonators to have a significant effect on a result.

HousePlantQueen

Joy241

This is a difficult one. Yes, it can be discriminatory, but I do understand that while there are vote fixing scandals around, something needs to be done. It is a balancing act.

which 'vote fixing scandals' are you talking about? Or are you parroting our friend Trump? It really isn't acceptable to make wild statements without evidence.

HousePlantQueen No, I am not parroting anyone, let alone Trump, who is no friend of mine! There is still an investigation going on in my own area after council elections. Whether the allegations prove true or not, there is obviously reason for the security to be suspect

Well if they have discovered something that needs investigation, their systems are good enough to identify issues and allow them to be assessed.

Is the problem in your council area personation? Is it large scale? Because if it's not, then it's unlikely that photo ID will solve any potential problem.

We shouldn't just introduce limits on our democratic rights without very good reasons for doing so and right now, we don't have any reason at all.

Is the problem in your council area personation? Is it large scale? Because if it's not, then it's unlikely that photo ID will solve any potential problem.

Took the words out of my mouth, volver

Having read most of this thread, I'm still none the wiser about postal voting. How can I prove my identity by putting X on a form and posting it back. Especially in homes of multiple occupation or in blocks of flats, the mail may be quite easily appropriated by the wrong person. Where the voter who received it is confused or speaks another language, someone else may 'help' them to cast their vote. It's a small minefield but it does happen.

MaizieD

nanna8

I have been a poll clerk and vote counter a couple of times,too. It would be quite easy during the counting process after the boxes are emptied. I believe they are going to change things here ,they have finally worked it out. I hope they bring ID s in,too. Probably they will at some stage because they like to collect non voter fines. We have a Premier who is blatantly dishonest so trust is an issue . No one trusts politicians here.

This is totally irrelevant to the matter of voter ID.

No amount of voter ID would stop your rather wild scenario of the counter getting busy with a rubber... (and how many votes would have to be altered to affect the result?)

We're talking about a person pretending to be another person in order to cast a fraudulent vote. Which is, in itself, a pretty wild scenario. You'd need 100s or 1,000s of impersonators to have a significant effect on a result.

The Australian system is already very different to ours. It's probably quite difficult to compare them but ... I do like the fact that you have to vote as long as they issue the statistics for those who don't want anyone mentioned on the voting paper.

Counting could be mechanised. It could cost less and be quicker. However, we would all want to know it is at least as accurate.

I don’t see why proving who you are with photo ID is a loss of democratic rights. For those who haven’t already got photo ID it is proposed that councils will issue a photo card to them. The rest of us have passports, driving licenses etc. No one will be stopped from voting.

Forcing people to vote would entail a loss of democratic rights. Although many countries do insist on it, and I can understand that, some people simply don’t want to vote, or can’t be bothered. We already have postal voting, and so everyone can vote if they want to. But homeless people without an address may be unable to vote as they have no address. Photo ID would give them the right to vote.

maddyone

I don’t see why proving who you are with photo ID is a loss of democratic rights. For those who haven’t already got photo ID it is proposed that councils will issue a photo card to them. The rest of us have passports, driving licenses etc. No one will be stopped from voting.

1. It's a right that we give up at our peril. Sorry to be overdramatic, but we have never had to prove who we are at point of voting to take part in democracy in this country, and there is nothing to say we need to do that now.

2. If you have to apply for something, that inherently will put some people off. People who struggle with literacy. People who can't get to the council offices. People who are suspicious of authority. People who find it difficult to interact with authority. People who have always had the right to vote and who are having it chipped away at because of some spurious and unproven idea that we "need more security".

3. Many will be stopped from voting.

We don't have ID cards in this country because none of us need to prove to anyone who we are, just for walking down the street. If we are obliged to have ID cards to be a part of the democratic process in this country, then that is no longer democratic. Are we really saying that we trust governments to always act honourably where Voter ID is concerned? With this lot in power?

Finally - how do you get that photo ID from the council if you don't have an address? Can we have some critical thought about this proposed process and what it really means please?

If they didn’t force people to vote, no one would, so the system would be open to some sort of rabid dictatorship. That’s the issue here. We are different from you. Also it is a nice handy source of revenue of course along with speeding fines and traffic offences. I got fined once after a local council election. I was busy working and just forgot to vote and I didn’t know any of the candidates anyway.

If they didn’t force people to vote, no one would

What rubbish. I've lived in Australia. They value democracy as much as anyone else. This is absolute tripe, I'm sorry to say.

Apply for citizen card here it will cost you £15 - every 3 yrs!.
www.citizencard.com/apply-for-a-uk-id-card-online

Personally I think it should be free and mandatory

Either way I don’t see it introduced anytime soon, doesn’t affect me I have a passport.

You are so wrong Volver. I have lived here for 50 years and I know. You obviously weren’t here very long.