Sunak's Cabinet Changes

In one LizzieDrip

I think sending the document from her personal email account was a deliberate act.

(According to news today it was the lowest of the low security wise, nothing incriminating for the Gov or U.K. security)

Ms,Truss was not the MP’s choice, and they wanted her gone PDQ.

Volver I'm surprised your OH doesn't consider himself a Scot,I have friends who have been here for much less time then that and they proudly say they were English,Greek,Slovakian BUT they are new Scots and wouldn't ever call themselves anything else .They all come to the Indy marches and are all a big part in their communities .One has 3 restaurants locally and one who has just gone to Glasgow uni in her 50's to study Scottish History.Out of those 3 the longest living here is 10 years

Yes GrannyGravy. When the news broke about Braverman’s misdemeanour, experienced political commentators were clearly confused about why she had resigned. One even said ‘this wouldn’t normally be a resigning matter’ because it didn’t pose a security risk. But, of course, in order to use her resignation letter as a catalyst, she had to resign. I actually find it frightening that all this scheming may have been going on in the heart of government, while the UK is in the middle of an economic crisis!

What a conspiracy theory Lizzydrip
We know that there was a breach of security, which indeed has happened many times by Ministers or junior staff over the years, but there was also a report of a loud argument going on between Ms Braverman and Liz Truss, so the former just had to resign.
Yes indeed we have to give the element of time to the politicians in new posts, and even to the ones already in those posts appointed by Liz Truss just weeks ago.
The markets are already recovering, which is good news too.
I think there is reason to hope that the economic situation, which will be hard here and elsewhere too, is at least in the hands of sensible people.Other views and opinions are available on this thread.That is what makes for interesting reading on Gransnet.

paddyann54

Volver I'm surprised your OH doesn't consider himself a Scot,I have friends who have been here for much less time then that and they proudly say they were English,Greek,Slovakian BUT they are new Scots and wouldn't ever call themselves anything else .They all come to the Indy marches and are all a big part in their communities .One has 3 restaurants locally and one who has just gone to Glasgow uni in her 50's to study Scottish History.Out of those 3 the longest living here is 10 years

How can anybody who is English call themselves a Scot? It is simply untrue.They could call themselves an honorary Scot if they wanted to.
The people you refer to Paddyann54 have become British citizens presumably.

Unfortunately Prentice, I can only think in conspiracy theory terms these days. Nothing is ever as it seems any more.

I do know what you mean, but was it ever so?

Yes indeed we have to give the element of time to the politicians in new posts,

I would drop the 'we', Prentice.

Fair enough if you want to give them more time but it is generally expected that experienced politicians should hit the ground running when appointed to ministerial posts and that includes the top jobs.

I, and others on this forum, expect competence from the start.

LizzieDrip

Yes GrannyGravy. When the news broke about Braverman’s misdemeanour, experienced political commentators were clearly confused about why she had resigned. One even said ‘this wouldn’t normally be a resigning matter’ because it didn’t pose a security risk. But, of course, in order to use her resignation letter as a catalyst, she had to resign. I actually find it frightening that all this scheming may have been going on in the heart of government, while the UK is in the middle of an economic crisis!

No it was much more straight forward.

Braverman seriously breached the ministerial code twice, and was found out because she sent an e-mail containing ministerial document via her private gmail account in error to someone, who in turn reported it to the chief whip.

She then lied and denied, but all her lies fell apart immediately.

Truss had no choice but to sack her as a serious risk.

Now this next bit is opinion

I think Sunak did a deal with Braverman to get the loons ukippy types onside.

I think Sunak did a deal with Braverman to get the loons ukippy types onside.

Thanks WW. Again opinion here - whatever the series of events was, it would appear to involve much conniving and deal-making. Party politics over national interest!

Prentice

paddyann54

Volver I'm surprised your OH doesn't consider himself a Scot,I have friends who have been here for much less time then that and they proudly say they were English,Greek,Slovakian BUT they are new Scots and wouldn't ever call themselves anything else .They all come to the Indy marches and are all a big part in their communities .One has 3 restaurants locally and one who has just gone to Glasgow uni in her 50's to study Scottish History.Out of those 3 the longest living here is 10 years

How can anybody who is English call themselves a Scot? It is simply untrue.They could call themselves an honorary Scot if they wanted to.
The people you refer to Paddyann54 have become British citizens presumably.

paddyann54 maybe I didn't explain myself properly, sorry.

My OH considers himself a Scot, but given that there is no such thing as Scottish nationality, except in our hearts (sentimental moment there ) he can't call himself "Scottish". And he won't call himself English because he has nothing in common with most English people, except where he happened to be born.

His mother lived in Scotland for over 60 years, but was convinced she would be "sent home" if we got independence and never took part in any clubs etc in Scotland because her view was that "as soon as I opened my mouth they'd know I was English". Like anybody would care. ?? Misguided, thinking, I believe.

My husband is proud to live in a country like Scotland, supports independence and wants to call himself Scottish, but he would be challenged by people who think like Prentice and have no idea what a new Scot is.

LizzieDrip

^I think Sunak did a deal with Braverman to get the loons ukippy types onside.^

Thanks WW. Again opinion here - whatever the series of events was, it would appear to involve much conniving and deal-making. Party politics over national interest!

He is going to live to regret it.

Remember when he said the first thing that he would do would be to appoint a government standards bod?

Pity he didn’t do it before bunging in Braverman.

And he hasn’t employed the standards commissioner yet either.

I can’t see what the point was though, why didn’t Braverman just resign if she had lost confidence in Truss, rather than invent an elaborate mistake? I think she did make a major error, which is why it surprises me that Sunak appointed her, when he knew it would cause controversy. Surely there was another far right candidate who hadn’t blotted their copybook, or he could have given Mordaunt Home Secretary and Braverman Chief Paper Clip Unwinder?

Casdon

I can’t see what the point was though, why didn’t Braverman just resign if she had lost confidence in Truss, rather than invent an elaborate mistake? I think she did make a major error, which is why it surprises me that Sunak appointed her, when he knew it would cause controversy. Surely there was another far right candidate who hadn’t blotted their copybook, or he could have given Mordaunt Home Secretary and Braverman Chief Paper Clip Unwinder?

She is a security risk - simply that.

Labour going ask UC after PMQs requesting Braverman to make a statement.

Be surprised if she turns up tbh as Cooper will make mincemeat of her.

I agree. Knowing that though, why on earth did Sunak appoint her?

And he won't call himself English because he has nothing in common with most English people, except where he happened to be born.

I find that an odd thing to say.

English people are very diverse, they are not all alike!
And neither are Scottish people.

In fact, the Scots I know (whom I like and in one case was very fond of indeed) don't seem any different many English people I know.

Per George Monbiot in the Guardian

"Almost all the media reported a scripted comment by the newly reinstated home secretary, Suella Braverman, about the “tofu-eating wokerati”. Astonishingly, scarcely any of them reported what she was doing at the time. She was pushing through the House of Commons the most repressive legislation of the modern era.

Under the public order bill, anyone who has protested in the previous five years, or has encouraged other people to protest, can be forced to “submit to … being fitted with, or the installation of, any necessary apparatus” to monitor their movements. In other words, if you attend or support any protest in which “serious disruption to two or more individuals or to an organisation” occurs, you can be forced to wear an electronic tag. “Serious disruption” was redefined by the 2022 Police Act to include noise.

This is just one of a series of astounding measures in the bill, which has been hardly remarked upon in public life as it passes through Britain’s legislature. What we see here is two losses in one moment: the final erasure of the right to protest, and political journalism’s mutation from reporting substance to reporting spectacle. These are just the latest of our losses."

So, reading the above, any of you or children or grandchildren who have taken part in demonstrations during the last 5 years could be tagged. this is really scary.

We could make a complete nonsense of this policy if we all turned out to demonstrate.?

Callistemon21

^And he won't call himself English because he has nothing in common with most English people, except where he happened to be born^.

I find that an odd thing to say.

English people are very diverse, they are not all alike!
And neither are Scottish people.

In fact, the Scots I know (whom I like and in one case was very fond of indeed) don't seem any different many English people I know.

In fact, the Scots I know (whom I like and in one case was very fond of indeed) don't seem any different many English people I know.

Then you mix in very limited circles.

And if my OH says he doesn't have anything in common with a group of people, then whatever you think, he doesn't have anything in common with that group of people.

volver

Have you actually read that Guardian article Catscatscats?

I'm going to guess the answer is "no".

What! So the Guardian is not expressing relief, but expressing sarcasm? Wonders will never cease

I bet they are relieved, deep down. It could have been so, so much worse.

Starmer firing with all barrels at PMQs.

Still not getting answers though. Not sure what Sunaks reply to Caroline Lucas’s question regarding fracking meant. My MP has said it’s ‘absolutely clear ‘ that fracking will only take place if communities agree to it. However no one seems to know how that agreement will be reached. She obviously doesn’t realise that some of us listen to the parliamentary debates.

Why did the Tories cheer when Sunak talked about the mess the U.K. is in?

Weird.

What on earth do other countries make of Fabricant.

CatsCatsCats

volver

Have you actually read that Guardian article Catscatscats?

I'm going to guess the answer is "no".

What! So the Guardian is not expressing relief, but expressing sarcasm? Wonders will never cease

I bet they are relieved, deep down. It could have been so, so much worse.

Come on now.

You quote an article and use it to support your argument, then when it's pointed out that the article says the exact opposite of what you think it says, you say that they probably think the opposite of what they say anyway.

You should have a go at PMQs. On the Tory bench obviously.