Is Britain Broken?

"Labour party is ‘sticking two fingers up’ at working people, says Unite boss"
theguardian.com/politics/2022/jul/30/labour-party-is-sticking-two-fingers-up-at-working-people-says-unite-boss…

"The Labour Files, detailed harrowing bullying of party members by Labour’s bureaucracy and the rigging of democratic processes"
independent.co.uk/voices/labour-files-forde-report-keir-starmer-racism-b2198773.html

Grany can I ask you something? Why are you still in the Labour Party?

Grany

Labour is purging left-wingers from Parliamentary selection lists. Here’s how

Labour Hub has reproduced an important twitter thread by Angus Satow on Keir Starmer’s purge and the implications for Britain’s democracy.

I reproduce it in full below, in view of its importance:
voxpoliticalonline.com/2022/11/13/labour-is-purging-left-wingers-from-parliamentary-selection-lists-heres-how/#comments

What do you think of Starmer for doing that?

Also Labour is influenced by the Isreal lobby A foreign country

One of the first comments under that article speaks of "I am a Socialist but I shall NEVER EVER vote for Starmer aka Starmer’s Jewish wife who calls the pro-Zionist shots." Is it any wonder that people have accuse the Labour Part of being anti-semitic?

"The current register of donations including from Gambling & Private Health companies accepted by leading New Labour politicians.

Streeting £133,000. Reeves £279,000. Cooper £71,000. Phillipson £42,000."
morningstaronline.co.uk/article/f/betting-it-all-on-red-why-the-dodgy-donors-are-backing-labour-once-more

Labour is purging left-wingers from Parliamentary selection lists. Here’s how

Labour Hub has reproduced an important twitter thread by Angus Satow on Keir Starmer’s purge and the implications for Britain’s democracy.

I reproduce it in full below, in view of its importance:
voxpoliticalonline.com/2022/11/13/labour-is-purging-left-wingers-from-parliamentary-selection-lists-heres-how/#comments

What do you think of Starmer for doing that?

Also Labour is influenced by the Isreal lobby A foreign country

I agree, but who would people trust to be genuinely independent? And what would the impact be? I believe that the Leave campaign was based on lies, and am still rather resentful that the mess we are in was voted for and needn't have happened. I fully accept that it was as near to a democratic decision as we get these days, but I can't help the resentment at the fact that my pension is at risk before I even get it, the value of my savings is diminishing by the day, my children's futures have been irreparably damaged, the country is a much worse place than it was, and worst of all it was all unnecessary.

If the enquiry confirmed my beliefs, would I, and people like me, feel any better? I doubt it. And would those who voted Leave accept the results of the enquiry? I doubt that would happen either.

Even if they did, what difference would it make? They would feel as guilty as the Remainers feel resentful. And what would be gained? We had such a good deal from the EU before we left, and there is no chance we'd get it back. It's not even guaranteed that they'd have us back at all. The country would be riven apart again for little or no gain, beyond the dubious 'satisfaction' of being able to say 'I told you so'.

I think there should be an independent public enquiry about Brexit. It was based on lies and, as such, was wholly fraudulent. Those responsible should be held to account. Of course, it would have to get in the queue of enquiries that are currently pending involving this government.

From the FT too. Not exactly your leftie journal.

I knew in 2016 what could happen, and then had to live through that bus promising millions to the NHS. and then we get a lying "oven Ready" populist.

and tonight we've just had the news that Gavin Williamson, knighted, has resigned over bullying, offensive texts ..
unbelievable.
www.gransnet.com/forums/news_and_politics/a1317648-Will-the-corruption-ever-end-Gavin-Williamson-resigns

Here is a Youtube video from the Financial Times telling how Brexit has affected our economy.

Warning: It's it's very informative but very depressing!

www.youtube.com/watch?app=desktop&v=wO2lWmgEK1Y

My friend told me yesterday that the main hospital here in Edinburgh won't put any more people on their waiting list for knee surgery as its so full. ie they can't deliver the required care. If you have money you'll pay £15,000 for an op privately and otherwise you'll wait up to several years and suffer.
Many of our services and resources both governmental and privately owned have been ended. It's very difficult for people to get an NHS dentist and dentists that previously offered both private and NHS treatment are only private now.

Teachers are talking of having to supply pupils with vests and turn the heating down. Also support staffing is to be cut back.

We may have power cuts in the winter, many currently can't afford it even if it is available. Many children are hungry and neither they nor parents are getting the nourishment they need to stay healthy. People are working as much as they can and still using food banks. And now places want to charge people £10 a day to sit in a warm environment and drink coffee.

Much of this reminds me of when I lived in a 3rd world country 15 years ago.

So yes, our country is in deep decline and going steadily further down by the day.... in comparison to what we had previously achieved. And it is partly to do with the most serious crime committed during my lifetime .. that being Brexit, which has left us without the labour force that we so desperately need and being literally cut adrift as a tiny, and rapidly becoming insignificant, small island. We alienated our European friends and neighbours to discover that 'Rule Britannia' no longer does the job and the rest of the world that we were so sure would welcome us with open arms just sees us as a rather pathetic case!

The Tory government has not invested in our people or our country.
Cuts are happening everywhere for things that bring community together and give a sense of wellbeing.
One example...they refused to give any help to the Filmhouse here in Edinburgh, that had a really tough time during Covid. It brought the International Film Festival here during the Edinburgh Festival for many many.years.. thus bringing much artistic expression and revenue to the city. It didn't just serve as a place that brought world class can cinema here but much much more. It was a place where people met up....and it is only one of thousands of such things happening all over the UK. Our quality of life is being seriously eroded and in many ways. ... I could go on.....

So, yes, Britain IS broken.

I did read that they are kite flying to see the reaction towards various suggested policies.

Wyllow3

I don't think we are broken, but we need the right people in power to even begin to fix matters.

btw, just read in the Times at a friends house that Sunak intends to raise benefits in announcements to come in terms of inflation. If this is realised, I will be very glad, if surprised, and feel that at least one matter is being addressed. Will wait to see the T's and C's.

I think they’ve just been using the threat of not keeping benefits and pensions up with inflation is just so everyone will feel relief and gratitude when they announce that they are going to honour their own pledges. More dead cat strategy.

I can’t actually think,of anything that isn’t broken tbh.

It is all so bloody depressing.

Today I was reading that our national parks are in crises because of 10 years of cuts.

Yesterday I was reading that 75% of our leisure centres are closing.

At the weekend DS was telling us how the EA is worried about this winter and the likelihood that we will experience severe flooding. The EA has been unable to retain and recruit staff, because they are highly skilled engineers, environmentalists and scientists, ,who, because of 10 years of no pay rise meaning year on year pay cut, no longer find the EA a desirable place to work. As a result much of the work of flood defending etc had been delayed because there is no staff to carry the work out.

Joseanne

volver

Nobody in France works cash in hand? Nobody avoids paying their tax? Nobody is employed by unscrupulous people? No people trafficking?

I don't think so.

Maybe volver meant actual French people working somewhat on the black?
I'm not going to say, but we are often asked for "liquide" when handing over largish sums in France.

She may have done. We've had two instances where we were asked to do something slightly dodgy and one of them a court appointed expert. He had prepared a report on some building work which hadn't gone too well. He said he wouldn't charge us VAT if we paid the fee into a different account. He was very upset when we said no and was difficult about giving the appropriate copies of the report.

volver

Nobody in France works cash in hand? Nobody avoids paying their tax? Nobody is employed by unscrupulous people? No people trafficking?

I don't think so.

Maybe volver meant actual French people working somewhat on the black?
I'm not going to say, but we are often asked for "liquide" when handing over largish sums in France.

volver

Nobody in France works cash in hand? Nobody avoids paying their tax? Nobody is employed by unscrupulous people? No people trafficking?

I don't think so.

People do live under the radar in France - some of them Brits. Problems arise when you become ill. If you don't have a "carte vitale" you would have to pay for medical treatment. Some years ago my DH had pains in his chest and arm and I called the emergency service which responded within 15 minutes. He was taken to hospital where it turned out that he myocarditis. A few days after his return we received an invoice for his treatment - over 4000 euros. We did not have to pay this because we were/are in the system but it id show how much these things can cost. The first responder was a doctor who called out the SAMU (4 people) who then called out the pompiers to take him to the hospital.

Recently two friends are sorting out their pension entitlement. In both instances the social charges were deducted by the employer but not paid over to the tax man.

There are unscrupulous people everywhere.

ID cards still go a long way to controlling the situation. I have known many a Brit 'under the radar' worker especially the 'skilled builder', most lasted a couple of years and then went'home'to the unemployment benefit and NHS poorer than the started out because they couldn't access any welfare without an ID

I don't think we are broken, but we need the right people in power to even begin to fix matters.

btw, just read in the Times at a friends house that Sunak intends to raise benefits in announcements to come in terms of inflation. If this is realised, I will be very glad, if surprised, and feel that at least one matter is being addressed. Will wait to see the T's and C's.

Smileless2012

The meaning you have attributed to the term underclass is incorrect Skydancer. Underclass refers to the lowest social stratum, usually made up of disadvantaged minority groups.

This is true. We can't just go about making our own definitions of words, and expecting others to understand what we mean by them.

The word is not connected to 'untermensch' either. the underclass is a sociological term for the poor who cannot be classified as working class, as they do not work and tend to have no skills and limited education. It is nearer to 'lumpenproletariat' in meaning than 'untermensch' which is about whole races or other groups considered socially inferior regardless of their working or educational status.

As for whether Britain is broken, I think it is badly damaged. We have never had a fair or equal society, but the unfairness and inequality have both increased massively over the past 12 years, and (maybe more importantly) has become normalised and presented as the result of a meritocracy. Those at the top (whether they have earned their position, inherited it or had good luck) are seen as deserving, and those at the bottom as inadequate. I don't think that there is the sense of decency and desire for a fair society that there used to be, but that is just based on observation, so may not be accurate.

Turning that attitude around will probably be far more difficult than closing the gaps between rich and poor.

I agree that there is classic divide and rule being applied. Look at all the news reports of Albanian migrants and the implication (believed by many) that they are all drug dealers and people traffickers, perfect tactic to distract the electorate from the fact that they still can't get a bloody appt with their GP. Then we get the 'benefits' cheat' stories, all to inflame those who are just about managing (remember them, Mrs May?)

volver

Ohh, I have thoughts about nuclear power too - but that's not for this thread...

I'm sure you do volver. The power going off this winter will naturally affect those on the 'lowest rung' more than everyone else. I do think it's relevant. But you may be correct something for another time.

Let's hope the power stays on and power workers don't strike.

When people say they'd bale out of Britain and go elsewhere, are they sure another country might really want them? I agree, use our energies to fix the place we're in.

Ohh, I have thoughts about nuclear power too - but that's not for this thread...

volver

Nobody in France works cash in hand? Nobody avoids paying their tax? Nobody is employed by unscrupulous people? No people trafficking?

I don't think so.

They also still have many refugees living in tent cities on the northern coast with winter approaching.

The one good thing the French did do was invest in nuclear power. We chickened out of. I don't think their lights will go off this winter. We can blame the tories for a hell of a lot but others failed to secure our long term energy needs.

The lack of good social housing is a major cause of problems. All the fault of Mrs T but not put right by the Labour government. One of many mistakes made by a government we all hoped would put things right.

I want rid of this shower of s**t but I'm really not sure KS is the man to fix it.

Me too nadateturbe