Scotland's Gender Recognition Reform Bill to be debated today 20 Dec & voted on 21 Dec

Excellent move Rishi.

Well that's us put in our place then.

Have your devolution, but only if you do what we tell you.

What a disgrace.

BBC website is saying that Westminster is going to block this bill using a Section 35 order.

No I am not interested in showing people up. I am interested in showing the failings in safeguarding in terms of men accessing womens spaces.

volver

^what’s decided in Holyrood is for you holy writ.^

No, what's decided at Holyrood is law. That's how it works. 🤷🏼

Holy writ in that you seem to agree with any laws made in Scotland.
Don’t you care anything for the rights of women? Seems you’re in good company with Holyrood then.

volver

^You cant answer the sex segregated questions because there is no answer.^

So why do they keep being asked then? It wouldn't be to show people up, would it?

Oh you'd be shown up if you answered those and other questions? Confirms what I thought!

You cant answer the sex segregated questions because there is no answer.

So why do they keep being asked then? It wouldn't be to show people up, would it?

what’s decided in Holyrood is for you holy writ.

No, what's decided at Holyrood is law. That's how it works. 🤷🏼

The tactic of telling big lies wasn't originated by Hitler, it was a piece of anti-Jewish propaganda that he initiated and used to justify his actions.

Bit of history education needed here, maybe.

(It's analogous to that thing they say about car crashes here. I can't look away.)

By the way, Kellie-Jay Keen aka Posie Parker has no input at all into what is said by speakers at her events.
The whole point is to create an opportunity for anyone who wishes to say something about women's rights, children's rights and the changes happening because of transactivists' demands.
It's surprising how many different takes there can be, on those topics.

It's strange that trans supporters choose to simply shout slogans and threats, at these events, rather than simply mosey up and speak some coherent words on their viewpoint.
The police at Newcastle did an excellent job of keeping the shouting mob far away from the speakers, incidentally, which was a nice change from some previous events in other places.

if they affect anyone here in England, and they will, as hundreds of these certificates will be handed out and people move about

And I'm pretty sure that a lot of the movement will be 'GRC tourism' of people coming to Scotland for long enough to get the vital piece of paper then returning to England or Wales to demand their 'rights'.

It is, as that woman said, a Big Lie that men can be women.
If the tactic was originated by Hitler, why shouldn't she say so?

As you volver can't know if that woman is on this thread, it would have been helpful if you'd made clear what you meant.
Perhaps your slightly confusing style of posting causes some of the problems in this thread.

You cant answer the sex segregated questions because there is no answer. Everyone knows that. Thats why no debate was the first position because once debate starts the absolute absurdity of it all is clear.

GC icon . Actually subject to much divisive debate as you would know if you knew much about the issues.

I'm out.

At home or at work I wouldn't put up with being spoken to in the way you talk to people, volver, and I'm not putting up with it here either.

You appear to be incapable of debate, refuse to answer questions yet snarkily fire them at others, (I missed the link with its demand to watch a video) so there is no point in continuing the 'conversation'. As for 'opinionated juices' unless that was supposed to be an ironic comment I have rarely seen such a lack of self-awareness.

I am not flouncing from the thread, but declining to engage with you further on it.

I don’t think you are of the trans lobby Volver what I get from your comments is that you are of the Independence lobby and what’s decided in Holyrood is for you holy writ.
It doesn’t matter what’s decided there and becomes law you will have no criticism of it at all. All that seems to anger you is anything to do with Westminster.Have you given real thought to women’s worries about this?
I know that it wasn’t just the SNP but some Labour and others going along with this wokery, maybe for votes or to toe the
line and these matters are devolved, but if they affect anyone here in England, and they will, as hundreds of these certificates will be handed out and people move about, you can’t blame Westminster for thinking they may have to step in.
Put women first, no matter where in the UK they are.

What a thoroughly nasty thing to try and imply volver I do not endorse any of the vile thoughts or actions of Hitler, but just because he used the phrase "the big lie" it does not invalidate someone using that phrase to describe another big lie. Maybe you truly believe people can change sex, but as someone cognisant with biological science I know they can't, and that there are only two sexes, not the 'spectrum' beloved of the trans lobby.

And there we have it.

The person quoting Hitler (at a rally organised by GC icon Posey Parker?) is quite right.

As I said above, okey dokey.

Leaving you all now to stew in your own opinionated juices.

volver

FarNorth

Who has been denigrating or/and quoting Hitler?

www.youtube.com/watch?v=kIfvRnpcuug

Yep one person, not people which is plural. The reference to Hitler using the phrase 'the big lie' would probably have been best avoided, but she spoke the truth when she says the 'big lie' is that transwomen are women. They obviously aren't or they wouldn't need to transition would they? They remain male, a piece of paper with the marker saying female is just a big lie. Transwomen are transwomen or trans identified males if you prefer.
Would you like us to post videos of some of the thousands of abhorrent, vile things some transpeople and their allies have said, and also show them attacking women for expressing their rights to single sex spaces?

I posted a link at 12:30. What else do you want me to do? Mime it?

I have no idea what you are on about now. What has Hitler got to do with this? Is it Godwin's Law or another accusation that questioning the eradication of women equates to Nazi sympathies?

Or maybe a distraction from the perfectly reasonable and simple questions you were asked earlier, none of which had anything to do with Hitler.

The sketch? Oh well done.

What about the recording of a person at a Posey Parker-inspired rally quoting Hitler and using that as justification for what they believe?

No. I think I know the sketch you mean, and if so, it is a comedy about the signification of skulls, and how that is read by more 'thoughtful' SS members, if memory serves.

There is a vague link between that and 'baddies', in the same way as there is a link between the signification of the word 'woman' and its link to the concept of 'adult human female'. Corrupt the word/sign and you corrupt the meaning, whether that is to make the SS seem less odious or to make the concept of women less clear and therefore less powerful.

Are you looking for a debate about Semiotics here?

Just skipping over the Hitler bit then?

Okey dokey.

Good question, FN.

The whole premise of this 'debate' is that one 'side says that women are adult human females, and the other says that that POV is discriminatory, phobic and so on, and that women are, well, something that people have in their heads and is connected with authentic selves and being in the right body.

The point of language is that it allows people to use otherwise arbitrary signs to discuss concepts that go beyond pointing at things, and for that to work the signs have to be agreed amongst speakers of a common tongue. As soon as that breaks down, discussion is impossible, which is what is happening in the trans 'debate'.* The choice of language (eg the use of terms such as 'ranting') is also indicative of the attitude of the speaker/writer, but that is well-established on here on the whole, so tends to wash over me, other than to scream 'ironic'.

No tactics here. I have nothing to prove, as my position is clear - women are adult human females. As they have always been, and always will be, unless we evolve to the point where we reproduce differently. I think that the corruption of the language is very relevant to the discussion - it is one of my biggest fears about the whole trans situation (is 'situation' acceptable?) We can no longer compare figures about sex differences, as they are collected on the basis of so-called 'gender', and 'facts' don't mean what they did even five years ago. Where this will end is anyone's guess.

*I say 'debate', as any discussion needs to have both sides in a position of willingness to explain the reasons for their viewpoints, preferably backed up by evidence. If one side quotes data (in this case that the number of female paedophiles is 4%) to contradict someone else's figures of 1%, but is unable to say that they have even considered the validity of their source, or whether the two figures are based on research using the same parameters then the evidence is, at best, in doubt.

But yes. Why are you so resistant to answering questions, and in what way are they 'leading'?