Sometimes I am ashamed

It's pathetic

What is, exactly?

FarNorth

VS only men can be transwomen. That is a biological fact and it's not vile to say so.

We are repeatedly told that gender identity and sex are different things, but then that gender identity should be taken as if it is sex at all times.

If people could be honest about which sex they are, while presenting however they want, there'd be no objection from me or from most other GC people.

This has no relation to my comment but ok

I don't like the abject hate this will cause to innocent trans people and the abuse it puts them at risk for

That's what will happen if these vile misogynists are not stopped, unfortunately.
Unintended consequences.

You dislike my posting style volver - that's fine.
Have you any comment about an MSP, who I'd guess is not untypical, who clearly states that he simply voted as he was told?

I know many women who wrote to MSPs and got no reply at all from many of them, not even a standard reply of any kind.
I don't think it's too much of a stretch to think that those MSPs simply waited to be told how to vote and gave the matter no other thought.

As I said Granny23 was mistaken in thinking it was a free vote for all MSPs.

Quotes a deleted post. Message deleted by Gransnet. Here's a link to our Talk guidelines.

I don't think anyone called anyone else a serf.

Maybe I missed that bit.

You dislike my posting style volver - that's fine.

I dislike posts which manipulate language to misrepresent people's motives and mislead others into thinking something is the case when it's not.

Your comment has no relation to mine either doodledog

I've been told many times on gransnet that people have no problem with trans people being part of our communities as long as they arent in womens safe spaces or in womens sports...

Are you saying GC feminists and Terfs who want trans people to be denied gender dysphoria treatment, have conversion thetapy and be denied anything that at all that confirms a different gender... are the same?

I think doodle meant terf. It was on the charming signs. Die terf that's the most common one I have heard.
When you were talking about the threats of a car being driven into a protest, did you mean the man who has also threatened JK Rowling and Rosie duffield, I think he has been identified via social media.

But no one here is a terf right? No one here wants to exclude trans people from having basic human rights? No one here is denying trans people the right to be their authentic selves.
That’s right, but do explain trans ‘authentic self’ and how that differs from any other person’s authentic self.

Also my tone is not "sneering" and I don't think it is at all right to assign a tone to my comment that isn't there.

I'm not a very sneery person

I know she meant terf, but serf made me smile. 😆

It is apparently the case that most people of average intelligence can work out what someone is saying, even if all the vowels are missing. The research was done at Cambridge some time ago, I believe.

I wndr hw y hve mngd to msndrstnd a smpl typ?

VioletSky

Your comment has no relation to mine either doodledog

I've been told many times on gransnet that people have no problem with trans people being part of our communities as long as they arent in womens safe spaces or in womens sports...

Are you saying GC feminists and Terfs who want trans people to be denied gender dysphoria treatment, have conversion thetapy and be denied anything that at all that confirms a different gender... are the same?

No.

I am asking about which human rights you think are being denied (or that you think people wish to deny) to transpeople?

And also what is authentic about saying you are one sex when you are the other?

I know you knew what she meant. I just wanted to describe the experience many of us have had with the word terf.

That's me out then.

What with me being above average intelligence, and all.

Mollygo

But no one here is a terf right? No one here wants to exclude trans people from having basic human rights? No one here is denying trans people the right to be their authentic selves.
That’s right, but do explain trans ‘authentic self’ and how that differs from any other person’s authentic self.

It doesn't, that's the point I'm making about trans exclusionary radical feminism

But I've never heard anyone here claim to be trans exclusionary

Which is who I thought the term applies too

VioletSky

Mollygo
But no one here is a terf right? No one here wants to exclude trans people from having basic human rights? No one here is denying trans people the right to be their authentic selves.
That’s right, but do explain trans ‘authentic self’ and how that differs from any other person’s authentic self.
It doesn't, that's the point I'm making about trans exclusionary radical feminism

But I've never heard anyone here claim to be trans exclusionary

Which is who I thought the term applies too.
So your point is ?

As I say VS when I hear that word it is usually accompanied by threats of violence.

doodledog

The answer is in the comment you quoted...

Never mind

Not sticking around for nastiness

Just came to say that the extreme on both sides of the debate ie:

Trans extremusts making violent comments to anyone

Terf extremists making violent comments and trying to prevent trans people accessing medical treatment for gender dysphoria or being out in public at all

Are both just not thinking about the innocent people they are harming which includes women, lesbians and children

I just can't understand either

volver

That's me out then.

What with me being above average intelligence, and all.

Slf prs s n rcmmndtn

It's getting late to post against the wishes of autocorrect!

T s n my hs.

VioletSky

doodledog

The answer is in the comment you quoted...

Never mind

Not sticking around for nastiness

Just came to say that the extreme on both sides of the debate ie:

Trans extremusts making violent comments to anyone

Terf extremists making violent comments and trying to prevent trans people accessing medical treatment for gender dysphoria or being out in public at all

Are both just not thinking about the innocent people they are harming which includes women, lesbians and children

I just can't understand either

Ah. So my asking about which human rights are being denied, and what is meant by 'authentic' in this context is 'nasty', is it? And a cue for a flounce?

Nothing to do with the fact that you can't answer?

Lol my point is, if I really must repeat it again

Two wrongs make no rights

I've seen vile behaviour from extremists on both sides and wouldn't align myself with either.

I'm completely only here for those innocents caught in the crossfire while this war rages

Except when I'm not here

OK bye

Unless you want to apologise for calling me "sneery" doodledog

I do worry when people are so invested in a cause they must create scapegoats as an outlet.

This goes out to all the regulars if we can have a polite constructive discussion, let me know

If not my boundaries dictate this is not a thread for me