Sandi Toksvig met the Archbishop of Canterbury

Welby said that?! I’m stunned

I would have thought there are members of the Anglican church who don't say that as Christians?

It's quite big isn't it?

They must have gay family members and I can't believe that many would tell their own children who they are is a sin

Well done Sandi Toskvig!
It seems to me that all of the organised religions continue to treat people who are lgtbqa unequally. But I write as an non-religious person so could be wrong.

I think I'd be demanding change and if none were forthcoming, I'd change church

Gay people cannot change who they are

I think you cant stop people believing what they want to believe, there is no way to enforce that which hasnt led to absolute horror. However I think it's perfectly possible to ensure organisations dont discriminate in the services they offer.

Yes I agree, it's very possible to ensure organisations do not discriminate

To tell a whole demographic they are sinners for something is simple as who they love is discriminatory

Should churches be allowed to operate outside the law?

I dont think it is discriminatory under the law.

As far as I am aware it's not illegal to say I dont believe in gay marriage because of my religion, because religion is also a protected characteristic. It's one of those clashes of rights which are so tricky.

I personally think its absolutely awful and ridiculous but that doesnt mean it's against the law.

Well, technically different demographic have different rights in certain areas but that's to ensure different needs are met

Surely this is a violation of a basic human right if it prevents someone practising their belief or marrying under it or having support from their own family?

It might be all sorts of things but it's not illegal, using the law in relation to beliefs or thoughts is not something I would be keen on, mostly because it always impacts adversely on minority groups. I think there is more of an argument about marriage in that it is a service if you like, so in a way similar to refusing to sell someone apples because of their protected characteristic. However the exemption for the church re gay marriage was as far as I remember was written into law when gay marriage was introduced so you would have to change the law. Am sure someone will correct me if I am wrong

Most religions must see that their popularity is in huge decline, at least north of the equator

My worry would be if they do not accept marginalised groups, they will become one

For many groups the point is that the group defines its terms, or rules of engagement. So if you want, for instance, to restrict membership to people who live locally, or who have a high IQ, or who can speak Italian that’s ok. MENSA, the Hometown Garden Society and the Advanced Italian Conversation Group can only exist under those circumstances. As Galaxy says, it is a clash of rights.

I think it is wrong of the C of E to refuse to marry gay people, but if all religions had to behave in the same way they would cease to exist. I suspect that Justin Welby would personally like to be able to marry gay couples too, but I understand why he can’t order his priests to do so.

It will come in time, I think, and great strides have been made over the past 20 years. Cold comfort to those who want to consecrate their love now, of course, but unfortunately for them, a group who exists because of a belief system can’t be forced to alter those beliefs or they would no longer be the group they were.

The C of E is a lumbering dinosaur - a very rich one.

I suspect that the majority of votes against the acceptance of gay relationships come from the African congregation, although I could be wrong.

Most of the worlds deity religions reject gay relationship.

I think Jesus would disagree with Welby and I'm not at all religious.

JaneJudge

I think Jesus would disagree with Welby and I'm not at all religious.

Same here on both counts, JJ

The Cof E will not recognise or marry gay people because to do so would mean it would split. There are large and significant churches in Africa which are at present classed as Anglican which still regard homosexuality as a sin and an offence against God. No A of Canterbury wants to be the one under whose watch the church fractured. It almost did so over the appointment of women as ministers. I don't think this is to do with discrimination or equal opportunities. Nor is it really to do with the church in the UK.

twitter.com/sanditoksvig/status/1618676742113349637?t=YphtDkGQy9H8g8dwAp3eiA&s=19

I was listening to this earlier. The C of E is what it is and members accept this particular discrimination when they join. If the A of C doesn't want to split the church, then there is no way forward at this time but well done Sandi Toksvig for opening up the conversation.

Thanks for the link, my I-pad doesn’t do links.

You arent going to stop some people believing being gay is a sin, you arent going to stop people believing abortion is a sin, you arent going to stop some people believing sex before marriage is a sin, no matter how many slogans you chant. I may disagree with all the above beliefs but I am not naive enough to think you can stop other believing them.

Not at all surprised. There are still strong pockets of resistance regarding women priests...

Galaxy

You arent going to stop some people believing being gay is a sin, you arent going to stop people believing abortion is a sin, you arent going to stop some people believing sex before marriage is a sin, no matter how many slogans you chant. I may disagree with all the above beliefs but I am not naive enough to think you can stop other believing them.

But if the institution to which so many of these believers belong accept that everyone is born with a particular proclivity and there is sod all that they can do about it, then undoubtedly many will be dragged kicking and screaming into the 21st century.

If these institutions reject what the vast majority of people accept as part of the human condition, then imo they are doomed to failure and anonymity. There is a reason why their congregation if falling year on year.

Oh yes that could be a consequence of their beliefs.