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How did we lose our freedom of speech? Is it irreversible?

(106 Posts)
Veridica Sun 26-Feb-23 07:41:11

Siope

Frankly, you’re talking rot. Censuring someone is not the same as removing their freedom of speech. I rather suspect you meant censoring, which didn’t happen. Using your example: the experts on Covid were on television virtually daily.

That's OK to point out the difference. I don't mind that. I actually meant both because so many people, during Covid for example, were censured for disagreeing with the narrative such as the equally qualified scientists and doctors who offered alternative solutions to help people recover. The Great Barrington Declaration was treated with contempt by those who had the power, from Fauci downwards.

The experts who were chosen to front the government campaigns by appearing on TV are part of the problem I was referring to. They provided misinformation, starting with Neil Ferguson's horrendously miscalculated projections and kept going, even when we all knew they were flawed. The government itself didn't believe it, as evidenced by the parties.

I absolutely understand where you are coming from as I have had similar discussions with old friends but if you do your own research you will find things that contradict what the politicians who control the media tell you. Then, like me, you will make up your own mind. Please do me a favour by meeting me half way and looking up: YouTube Dr John Campbell who has done some excellent short videos, one of which is an interview with Prof Norman Fenton, also of London Uni. who has done much more work on the Covid data than Neil Ferguson. When Covid appeared, Dr John put out many videos to advise people on how to stay safe, then when the mRNA appeared to be failing and making people seriously ill or worse, he worked through the data and turned 180 degrees.

You don't have to believe everything that Dr John says (or mainstream media either!) but if you start to worry about the version being told by politicians and the experts they appoint, then you will understand the concerns that many of us are expressing.

MawtheMerrier Sat 25-Feb-23 23:47:58

So easy to be wise after the event.
I don’t accept your basic premise and as has been said, “censuring “ and “censoring” are not the same thing..
You make no argument to back up your claim that we have lost freedom of speech so I see no case to answer.

Siope Sat 25-Feb-23 23:45:06

PS: There is no significant variation of opinion. amongst scientists on climate change

Siope Sat 25-Feb-23 23:43:13

Frankly, you’re talking rot. Censuring someone is not the same as removing their freedom of speech. I rather suspect you meant censoring, which didn’t happen. Using your example: the experts on Covid were on television virtually daily.

Grantanow Sat 25-Feb-23 23:42:43

And the repudiation of experts in the run up to the Brexit referendum was appalling. If only they had been listened to we wouldn't be in half the mess we are now in thanks to 13 years of Tory misgovernment.

Veridica Sat 25-Feb-23 23:09:58

The mainstream media seem to have got into the habit of developing the most contentious issues of the day into a narrative which cannot be challenged. Before long this is reinforced by social media, often incubated by virtue signalling so that those who make a challenge face ostracism by their peers.

Having spent most of my working life with adults like Julie Walters in Educating Rita who discovered a thirst for knowledge later in life and never stopped asking questions, I am very shocked and disappointed at the numbers of people who have swallowed recent narratives without question. The truths are starting to emerge but many still get an apathetic response.

Brexit was a disastrous idea, mask wearing was ineffective, lockdowns had a serious impact on health, the "vaccines" were dangerous gene therapy, resulting in huge numbers of adverse effects, the Nordstream pipeline was blown up by the US as part of Biden's proxy war to weaken Russia and there is a huge variation of opinion from experts on global warming. The evidence to support all these issues is now in the public domain but mainstream media is only slowly embracing it and there is a reticence among those who believed the narratives to admit they were wrong. Remember how Ivermectin was ridiculed as a therapy for Covid? There are plenty of peer-reviewed papers now saying just the opposite.

The censuring of huge numbers of experts during Covid is probably the worst example of attacks on freedom of speech and we have a right to ask how the powers that be actually got away with it. Unless the public realises what has been going on, it will only get worse. 1984 was meant to be a warning, not a workshop manual! Can anyone offer some optimism on the subject?