After all these years of Tory government, does anything in the UK still work?

Poppyred

The trouble is …..when ever a Labour government are in power, they manage to make everything 10 times worse!

This Labour opposition has no clear agenda - just always moaning about the Tories.

Would you like to back that statement up with some facts, Poppyred?

The trouble is …..when ever a Labour government are in power, they manage to make everything 10 times worse!

The NHS was the best in the world under the Labour government.

We handled immigration with humanity and alacrity.

They didn't give money away to cronies for services and products that don't work.

How is that 10 times worse?

Look at reality, not dogma.

Reality not dogma? Okay take a look at

england.nhs.uk

Uk health system comes out on top in new report

Dated 14 July 2017

First before
US, Sweden, France, Germany, Netherlands, Canada,NZ, Norway, Australia

2017

Well there's no link and I'm on my phone so it's difficult to look.

But 2017 was six years ago. 😳

How many countries was it better than 13 years ago before it started it's decline?

I am on my phone too ….

The Passport Service is working very well 🙂.

www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/society/2021/aug/04/nhs-drops-from-first-to-fourth-among-rich-countries-healthcare-systems

ronib

What about the effects on the economy of the pandemic immediately followed by involvement with Russia and Ukraine?

Would have happened if Labour had been in charge? Economic consequences of both events still ongoing.

The pandemic and involvement with Ukraine happened in every EU country.So why is the UK now in such a dire position?

From where I'm sitting (in France) the health service is a lot better than that in the UK. Both I and my DH have had occasion to use the French health service many times during the last 10 years and have no complaints (apart from the food in my local hospital which was grim).

My DH is having a new knee in May and afterwards will go to a convalescence hospital for around 15 days.

Last October I need an emergency op. I'd gone to the doctor who told me to go to hospital immediately. My DH drove me and this meant that I had to join the queue for admission. I waited 45 minutes. Had I called an ambulance I would have been taken in to the emergency ward immediately. No waiting outside in an ambulance for a long time. Whilst I was in hospital I noticed that none of the staff appeared to be under any time pressure - from the consultants down to the cleaners, or vice versa.

If we paid the same in taxes as the French do then we may get a similar service.Worth trying.

Oreo

If we paid the same in taxes as the French do then we may get a similar service.Worth trying.

Oreo Agree with this but there seems to be a refusal to even discuss this. The reply from my mp ignored my suggestion to raise taxes to pay for an improvement in Nhs provision. Are any politicians going to suggest this? Lean and mean seems to be in fashion at the moment.

Dinahmo yes of course you are right. Yes all countries affected by pandemic and Ukraine . Could be the Brexit factor therefore?

I don’t understand the mindset behind the Nhs at all in the UK and am very envious of the care you receive when required! Gladly pay more for a better service.

fancythat

The more I read left wing threads like this, the more I am put off voting Labour again.
Even when I lean towards doing so sometimes.

Unless you are a full on, hard left, and nothing is wrong with Labour ever ever type person, nothing else is anywhere near good enough.

Well I wont be that, so I need to walk away.

There aren't many extremist Labour supporters on here. Most supporters are critical of the LP at some point. They cannot please everyone.

I could be wrong but I suspect that most supporters would like a left of centre party, whose manifesto deals with all the points listed in the OP apart from the last two.

It will take a very long time to restore whatever international reputation we once had and most of us now know that Brexit has not been a success and never will be.

ronib

Oreo

If we paid the same in taxes as the French do then we may get a similar service.Worth trying.

Oreo Agree with this but there seems to be a refusal to even discuss this. The reply from my mp ignored my suggestion to raise taxes to pay for an improvement in Nhs provision. Are any politicians going to suggest this? Lean and mean seems to be in fashion at the moment.

I’ve got no idea where you’ve got the idea from that people don’t support increased taxation to pay for improved public services ronib, some right of the party Tory supporters may feel that, but I’ve never heard any Labour or Lib Dem supporter say that, here or elsewhere?

In answer to the OP

NO.

It's not just about the amount of taxes raised; it is also about how it is spent. If it is spent on efficient services, then I am more than happy to add to the coffers. If it is spent on pathetic window-dressing projects, endless data-gathering, jobs and orders for government mates, rigid political dogma - then I am less happy. Hence I have been unhappy for quite a few years now.

Casdon my Tory mp refused to even acknowledge raising taxes as a possibility. So focus from mp definitely on keeping wages within reasonable limits to meet economic growth and targets. The argument was it’s essential to keep inflation under control and so on.

Casdon An increase in tax to improve the NHS services has often been mooted and popular opinion seems to agree. Unfortunately the British public want to pay less tax and not more, particularly those who have private medical insurance.

Adrian Ramsay in Any Questions yesterday proposed that unearned income should be taxed the same as earned income. As many, if not most, of the richest in society, benefit from unearned income I think this is a good idea.

choughdancer

Adrian Ramsay in Any Questions yesterday proposed that unearned income should be taxed the same as earned income. As many, if not most, of the richest in society, benefit from unearned income I think this is a good idea.

It's a good idea and possibly most people would agree. Those who are employed, and therefore workers, will be paying income than those who play the stock markets and I don;t think that's equitable.

The government spends before it taxes even though it likes you to believe it's the other way round. The reason the NHS is such a mess is because the government refuses to invest the necessary money in it for purely ideological reasons.

If there were more money put into the NHS the tax take would increase without anyone having to pay a penny more because there would be more money circulating in the economy and just about everything purchased with that extra money, goods and services, is subject to taxation.

France is in a completely different situation because of using the euro. It cannot make independent decisions about how much money to put into the economy. Money supply in eurozone countries is controlled by the European Central Bank.

One of the best things we did was decline to adopt the euro...we retained our monetary sovereignty.

Dinahmo

choughdancer

Adrian Ramsay in Any Questions yesterday proposed that unearned income should be taxed the same as earned income. As many, if not most, of the richest in society, benefit from unearned income I think this is a good idea.

It's a good idea and possibly most people would agree. Those who are employed, and therefore workers, will be paying income than those who play the stock markets and I don;t think that's equitable.

We've had at least one thread about this quite recently. Some Gnetters passionately defend the unequal treatment of the wealthy...

Of course we have to include "unearned" income in the general tax code. I think the word "unearned" doesn't help; it is income, just as the pay for a 40 hour week is income.

But as you say Maizie, we have been here many times on GN.

On Times Radio yesterday an author was talking about his new book about how Westminster doesn't work. He claimed:

In the past 23 years we've had 23 Housing Secretaries

Last year only 1% of asylum claims were processed

In the US the defence secretary is often a 4-star general; in the UK we had Gavin Williamson!

Don’t look at the US, though. I don’t think they are a good example. The UK is a much safer place which is a positive.