Labour will be a major reforming government

Of course it's not at all self indulgent to call rapists female, that not the height of self indulgence. I will vote labour whatever happens. The Tories who care nothing about womens rights or transpeople will use it because it's an open goal. So I would appreciate it if Starmer was prepared, as I say he has already changed tack after watching a range of people looking foolish.

Sadly I cannot vote for Labour whilst he has people like Angela Raynor and Emily Thornberry in prominent positions they are two women who are dreadful
Role models . As for his vote for 16 year olds - I despair

Why are they dreadful role models?
Presumably Sunak is a dreadful role model as he was fined by the police for his behaviour in the pandemic.

Why are they dreadful role models?

Ilovecheese

Why are they dreadful role models?

I'm wondering that, too, Ilovecheese

I’d like to know too. Rayner in particular seems a great role model for working class girls, as I and my sisters once were, to me.

Mollygo, I didn't infer that only Tory voters were concerned about trans gender issues, I said that many seem to be using this as an excuse to vote for the Tories again. I am concerned about The Green Party allegedly getting funding from a puberty blocker manufacturer, same as i am unhappy about the huge number of Tory MPs getting funded from private health providers. To be frank, only the latter will affect me, so it will influence my vote

Galaxy

Why are they dreadful role models?
Presumably Sunak is a dreadful role model as he was fined by the police for his behaviour in the pandemic.

I was surprised when he got fined for apparently turning up for a meeting early hardly the crime of the century

I dont actually have strong feelings about Sunak and his fine but if Rayner is not a good role model then presumably police involvement is not actually role model of the year material.

ruthiek

Sadly I cannot vote for Labour whilst he has people like Angela Raynor and Emily Thornberry in prominent positions they are two women who are dreadful
Role models . As for his vote for 16 year olds - I despair

Angela Rayner is foul mouthed, has no manners whatsoever, talks over people and interrupts constantly.

Emily Thornberry is arrogant and also always has to have the last say which means she also talks over people.
She is probably most famous for her “white van man” remarks.

Both of them spend most of their time being nasty or rude to the Conservative party but fortunately they do not lower themselves to AR and ET’s standards.

I mean they've decimated the NHS, pumped sewage in to sea and taken Russian money, but at least they haven't talked over anybody. And they are so polite, especially that nice Mr Rees Mogg.

I absolutely agree, Primrose. Can anyone imagine AR being deputy PM? Standing in if the PM is ill or otherwise engaged? Dealing with foreign dignitaries?

To be fair watching Johnson do any of those things was excruciating.

Not half as excruciating as AR would be. Imagine her alongside eloquent, chic ladies such as Ursula von der Leyen, Mme Macron, Dr Biden …. She’s a foul-mouthed embarrassment.

Germanshepherdsmum

Not half as excruciating as AR would be. Imagine her alongside eloquent, chic ladies such as Ursula von der Leyen, Mme Macron, Dr Biden …. She’s a foul-mouthed embarrassment.

I agree with you there, and am hoping that Starmer can somehow manage to demote her and replace her if he gets into power next time.

Mollygo

The remarkable assumptions (or claimed knowledge) from some GN posters on how people vote, never ceases to amaze me.
I can’t /don’t vote Conservative
Labour have a leader afraid to say females don’t have a penis-so that will be the party line.
Lib Dem’s quite happy to endorse the idea that males can become females and said

transphobic behaviour included using phrases such as a “biological man” or “biological woman”; advocating for separate-sex facilities;
So forget their support for female rights.
(should fit in well with the party whose leader can’t say females don’t have a penis)

Greens get funding from a firm selling puberty blockers for children.

Sad that you decide (quite incorrectly) that anyone concerned by these issues must automatically be a Conservative voter.
Thinking this is important doesn’t automatically negate concern about any other issues.

Such a good comment that I’m reposting it.

Emily Thornberry didn't make any 'white van man' remarks. It's a figment of your tory imagination.

And I have a feeling that Ursula von der Leyen, Mme Macron and Dr Biden aren't arrant snobs...

Many voters are

Oreo

Germanshepherdsmum

Not half as excruciating as AR would be. Imagine her alongside eloquent, chic ladies such as Ursula von der Leyen, Mme Macron, Dr Biden …. She’s a foul-mouthed embarrassment.

I agree with you there, and am hoping that Starmer can somehow manage to demote her and replace her if he gets into power next time.

Yvette Cooper will hold her own in the chic and eloquent ladies arena, not that being chic has any relevance to anybody’s ability to do the job.

No women in the Labour shadow cabinet compares in sheer unfit for the job lack of capability as Sue Ellen Braverman, Priti Patel, or Therese Coffey (also, if we are going to get personal about appearance, imagine her stood next to Ursula von der Layen).

I’m not the biggest fan of Angela Rayner, and agree that she is rough round the edges - but she cares, and that counts for a lot in my book.

Ah, Yvette Cooper, now you’re talking 👍🏻

Hmmm, I care Casdon but wouldn’t be up to doing that job,
I think it needs more than that tbh.Yvette Cooper would be a great choice tho.

Of course, she just happened to film outside which stood a white van. Her purpose was obvious, whatever the colour of your politics.

UvdL et al would be too polite to express their feelings in public. AR seems not to understand the meaning of ‘polite’. Cringeworthy.

HousePlantQueen

Mollygo, I didn't infer that only Tory voters were concerned about trans gender issues, I said that many seem to be using this as an excuse to vote for the Tories again. I am concerned about The Green Party allegedly getting funding from a puberty blocker manufacturer, same as i am unhappy about the huge number of Tory MPs getting funded from private health providers. To be frank, only the latter will affect me, so it will influence my vote

Just to solve the “allegedly” Re: Ferring Pharmaceuticals
8 Dec 2019 — A pharmaceutical firm that markets drugs used in gender-identity clinics to delay puberty has given £100,000 to the Liberal Democrats.
Great that it doesn’t affect you. Others have grandchildren that will be affected.

Germanshepherdsmum

Not half as excruciating as AR would be. Imagine her alongside eloquent, chic ladies such as Ursula von der Leyen, Mme Macron, Dr Biden …. She’s a foul-mouthed embarrassment.

Much as I respect those ladies I doubt if they would have achieved what they have done if they’d started from the sort of background that Angela did. She also has a disabled child I believe.

It’s absolutely no excuse for behaving and speaking as she does.