Into the abyss - NHS Consultants have voted for strike action

They are being paid by the taxpayer and they always knew that would be the case unless they were able to move into private healthcare or general practice or move abroad. They don’t however have the freedom to move to another employer that lawyers, accountants and bankers and they knew that from the outset. They made that choice.

www.bma.org.uk/bma-media-centre/bma-says-increased-medical-school-places-are-welcomed-but-funding-must-be-found-for-extra-clinical-placements

Responding to the announcement that extra medical school places will be available this year, Dr Mary Anne Burrow, co-chair of the BMA medical academic staff committee, said:

“We welcome the news that there will be extra funding for medical school places as this desperate need for more doctors in training is a recommendation that we made in our Medical Staffing in England report, which we issued last month.

“However, this increase in student places must not come at the expense of extra funding for the existing workforce or reductions in funding in future years, because tackling the waiting lists and backlog are going to require sustained investment over many years. And the government must make clear that there will be sufficient clinical placements for all those who succeed at medical school.

“We don’t have enough doctors, those that are working are exhausted and burned out. Finding the money to train doctors of the future is therefore essential but must be matched with the right investments in medical educators and clinical placements to ensure that this leads to a sustained increase in the medical workforce.”

Surely a country rated the firth or sixth richest in the world should be able to train its own doctors?

We have a huge number of well qualified and highly motivated school leavers who want to enter the medical profession,.

We should not be depending on doctors coming here from overseas countries which need them. This is a political failure

Germanshepherdsmum

They are being paid by the taxpayer and they always knew that would be the case unless they were able to move into private healthcare or general practice or move abroad. They don’t however have the freedom to move to another employer that lawyers, accountants and bankers and they knew that from the outset. They made that choice.

Fortunately some talented, academic young people are not completely motivated by money but that doesn't mean they should not be paid properly and as I keep saying, that is why anyone who wants a functioning NHS should support them. GSM, we have been round this loop many times before and we won't agree. We have a desperate shortage of consultants in most of the specialisms and training doctors to consultant level takes years. As the NHS is the only training option in the UK, I want young talented academic people to see becoming a doctor as an interesting, demanding and well paid profession that is valued by society and one that they aspire to if they just want a money and a big house, probably they are not cut out for medicine and should go for something else.

Quite so. If anyone simply wants money then they don’t consider a career in medicine. Doctors are valued by society but they should understand from the outset that being valued by society and being paid a lot of money by society are very different things. What society will pay a professional person and what the individual who is paying the bill will pay are entirely different.

GSM so pleased we have found agreement

If middle income is now from £75,000 to £125,000, I don't think they are being unreasonable.

If this seems like too big a jump, the the government could have spread it out over the last 13 years. Only the government has had the power to do this, and they chose not to. Only the government is to blame.

If, as I heard, a doctor can move to Australia and get twice the pay. The can work the same hours as they now working a week but over two weeks there. Double the money for half the hours. If this tempts more, and it is bound to , our hospitals will become even more depleted,. The only people to blame for this will be the government yet again. Who else can it be?

‐-pay. The--
And can then

I don't actually think pay for doctors is as good in Australia as we may think and the cost of living is higher too.

Callistemon21

I don't actually think pay for doctors is as good in Australia as we may think and the cost of living is higher too.

Agreed

BMA delegates voted to restrict the numbers of doctors in training. Selfish and short sighted.

Aveline

BMA delegates voted to restrict the numbers of doctors in training. Selfish and short sighted.

No they didn't ......yawn..................

Aveline

BMA delegates voted to restrict the numbers of doctors in training. Selfish and short sighted.

British doctors earn an average of £70,000. But in Australia, they earn an average of a practice's income, which is normally on average somewhere between £150,000-200,000 per year. And they do it with much less mental stress and fatigue.22 Feb 2023
Lots of info on the internet if anyone can be bothered to look. Medics in Australia have much higher salaries and better working conditions and they are actively recruiting UK doctors now.

Above not meant to be attached to Aveline's comment!

foxie48 the Australian Healthcare system is predominantly private accept for the lowest paid, not really comparable.

Have just spent the day with two of our Aussie family who are over here, nothing but complaints about their system (both young by GN standards)

The grass isn’t always greener

Not saying it is GG13 but doctors are much better paid and have better working conditions, I've not said anything about the quality of the patient care.

Callistemon21

I don't actually think pay for doctors is as good in Australia as we may think and the cost of living is higher too.

I was taking that from an interview I heard on the radio with a doctor who was all organised to go and explaining why. He actually dwelt on the shorter hours more than the money.

foxie48

Not saying it is GG13 but doctors are much better paid and have better working conditions, I've not said anything about the quality of the patient care.

Depends on where they work and the demographics.

House prices, food, clothing and particularly footwear are rising.

There is no middle ground High Street as we have in the U.K.

The Government has brought in regulations on who can buy property/land to try and slow the housing prices from rising.

Might look good on paper but the reality is somewhat different.

Foxie- yes they did! Google it.

Aveline

*Foxie*- yes they did! Google it.

I know two doctors through work who now live and work in WA, they love it, because the staffing ratios are better, the hospitals are new and well equipped, they are paid much more, and perhaps most importantly, they feel valued. It’s not just better on paper, or not so many British doctors would go and not return.
My daughter cut her hand very badly when we were there last time, and she saw four doctors in total, three of them were Brits.

Whoops sorry I didn’t mean to tag your post Aveline, don’t know how it happened.

I think medics shouldn’t be allowed to strike. Same as the Police and the Armed Forces.

Urmstongran

I think medics shouldn’t be allowed to strike. Same as the Police and the Armed Forces.

Totally agree 👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻

DaisyAnneReturns

Callistemon21

I don't actually think pay for doctors is as good in Australia as we may think and the cost of living is higher too.

I was taking that from an interview I heard on the radio with a doctor who was all organised to go and explaining why. He actually dwelt on the shorter hours more than the money.

I thought the pay is comparable but yes, the working conditions are probably far better.
And, of course, so many work in the private sector funded by insurance where pay is probably much better.

Urmstongran

I think medics shouldn’t be allowed to strike. Same as the Police and the Armed Forces.

But they are not like the armed forces and police.

"The right to strike is 'a fundamental one enshrined in international human rights and labour law, and its protection is necessary in ensuring just, stable and democratic societies."

I wonder what sort of society those who want to take away our rights expect us to live in.