Time to admit that privatisation of national utilities isn’t working?

Thames water have paid dividends to their shareholders at the expense of improving the infrastructure.

The shareholders have been paid more than they should have done at the countries expense.

And it isn't just TW's Australian shareholders who are pocketing cash, I read yesterday that the chief exec has resigned, and waived her annual bonus. Which was about £400k. Goodness knows what her salary was.

What on earth has Ofwat been up to? Or not been up to. Turning a blind eye to Offrip that's what. It's time the utility regulators were given a broader remit and more teeth with which to gnaw at it.

Water is a monopoly and should be nationalised without compensation given the massive profits given to shareholders at the expense of racking up enormous debts (which the taxpayer will have to cover) and dumping sewage (which they are now claiming should be paid for by the customers through increased charges). Absolute disgrace and Labour should deal with this after the next GE if the Tories don't.

Nationalisation without compensation to shareholders would be theft if the shares have a value,

Grantanow

Water is a monopoly and should be nationalised without compensation given the massive profits given to shareholders at the expense of racking up enormous debts (which the taxpayer will have to cover) and dumping sewage (which they are now claiming should be paid for by the customers through increased charges). Absolute disgrace and Labour should deal with this after the next GE if the Tories don't.

The Labour Party are not talking about re-nationalisation, I noticed. They're talking about mutuality which seems to mean different areas choosing the best way for themselves.

I would really like to see more detail of this as I'm not in favor of nationalistion or this foolish privatisation of a natural monopoly. I do like what I think Starmer is saying, which seems to be, that you start from the bottom and work upwards to Parliament rather than working from parliament and make it into a top down system. Local Communities then have control over their own water but can also feed it into the rest of the country.

Here are some shocking figures from another Guardian article.
Quote below:

Cat Hobbs, the founder of the public ownership campaign group We Own It, added: “England has chosen to hand over its essential water infrastructure wholesale to privatised monopolies, owned by a handful of shareholders around the world. They have extracted £72bn in dividends while letting pipes leak and pouring sewage into our rivers and seas. And they have collectively built up a debt mountain of £53bn, although they started out in 1989 with zero debt.

www.theguardian.com/environment/2023/jun/28/thames-water-customers-financial-inquiry-river-safety-concerns-pollution-shortages-government-regulator-bailout

Privitisation has been an unmitigated disaster.

Selling off council houses at a knockdown price while forbidding councils to build new homes with the process may have bought a few votes for Margaret Thatcher but has caused a dire housing shortage.

Privitisation of the railways by separating the railway lines from the trains and breaking up any co-ordinated timetabling has meant that we now have the most expensive and least reliable railway service in Europe.

The privitised energy companies pay out dividends whilst imposing huge price hikes on consumers.

Privitised water companies have used the umpteen billions they have borrowed to pay shareholders and give huge bonuses to directors instead of investing in clean water and modern sewage treatment plants, hence we see sewage polluting our rivers and beaches

Privitised prisons and probation services have caused chaos in the penal system seeing more and more repeat offenders.

Of course, the chances of any Tory politician admitting that privitisation has damaged our country are about as high as the chances of them admitting that brexit was a very serious mistake.

If only we lived in a democracy, where a government could only be elected by the majority of voters, neither of these disasters might never have happened.

I agree with you to much of this has been an unmitigated disaster varian. However, I would not like the next government to swing to the other extreme of wholesale state ownership. Communities need to be much more involved.

Germanshepherdsmum

Nationalisation without compensation to shareholders would be theft if the shares have a value,

Yes, the shares need to be purchased but are they worth much anyway?

Water should never have been privatised.

Welsh Water is a not-for-profit company but really, some of the disasters are as bad as those of other water companies.
Pollution of the rivers here is really shocking.

GSM, you make the point that nationalisation without compensation to shareholders would be theft if the shares have a value. Would that still hold good in the face of proven neglect of the company's obligations??
Even in Australia the shareholders presumably have some sort of corporate responsibility for understanding the company's affairs.

I heard on the way home from work, that neither Labour nor LibDem want to nationalise Thames water.

Germanshepherdsmum

Nationalisation without compensation to shareholders would be theft if the shares have a value,

Was it theft when a nationalised industries were sold off into private hands?

Thames water is owned by foreign companies who make a profit off the consumers. It’s a disgrace. It’s not as if we can take our custom elsewhere. Sold off for greed. how can they pay out vast dividends when they have racked up huge debts? They were sold off without debts.

Obscene amounts of money being made and a cavalier attitude regarding customer satisfaction. And yet, I bet most of us can recall the bad old days of the monopoly British Telecom had with some folk on a waiting list for a telephone line - several months sometimes! I remember my brother in law and his wife having to share a number with some neighbours - a so called ‘party line’. Lifting up the receiver to make a phone call, hearing the neighbours already using the line! Monopolies aren’t always perfect either.

* That was Manchester back in 1972.

Doodledog

Germanshepherdsmum

Nationalisation without compensation to shareholders would be theft if the shares have a value,

Was it theft when a nationalised industries were sold off into private hands?

When companies go bust and are worthless because nobody wants to buy them, shareholders aren’t compensated, and I’m sure the government doesn’t actively want to buy Thames Water.

Urmstongran

* That was Manchester back in 1972.

We moved here in the 1980s and used to pick up the phone to make a call and hear some unknown neighbour (a couple of streets away, we found) chatting away.
They also allocated us an old number which had belonged to a local business. We received a lot of phone calls asking if they could book us for entertainment at weddings, parties and other functions!
"No, but I can come and tap dance and sing badly" 😁

I always thought that privatising water was wrong and in fact immoral.

Actually, I do think the shareholders in Thames Water have received quite enough in profits over the years.
Shares do bottom out and it's a risk you take when you invest.

Water companies are local monopolies and should never have been privatised.None of us can shop around for another
supplier.

Thames Water have borrowed money, not to invest in their business , but to pay shareholders huge dividends. They aren’t efficient. We recently had problems with water pressure in our area. They sent dozens of engineers to individual houses before they admitted they had caused the problem in the first place. A complete farce. The CEO should be in jail , not paid £ millions.

Germanshepherdsmum

Nationalisation without compensation to shareholders would be theft if the shares have a value,

If the company is in effect bankrupt. China and Abu Dhabi owners have overseen a company that has failed, I’m not sure why they should be compensated, when they have milked the monopoly year on year. The pension funds should be the ones to be protected.

This is what happens when utilities should never have been privatised.

In the past year Thames Water company has transferred £37 million to its parent company -sat in China.

Taxpayers shouldn’t be bailing out or compensating private water companies. We shouldn’t finance their debt. We are the only country who allows private companies to run water services. It’s a failed experiment. Renationalise now!