Fawcett Society's Victory for Women

The patriarchy. There we go again. I don’t subscribe to all that tosh in the 21st century. Try living the lives our female ancestors did when even the clothes on their backs belonged to their husbands and if they were fortunate were bequeathed to them when their husbands died. Enjoy arguing amongst yourselves.

I had to smile reading the last few

Mollygo

Weird post Glorianny.
Of course many women maintain cordial relationships with men. Didn’t you know that?
I’ve been saying for a long time that the patriarchy exists. So have many others.

Where has anyone been saying that it doesn’t?
Who was it?
Where has anyone denied that the patriarchy is used to control and denigrate women?
Who did so?
Are your claims supported by any evidence?

Mollygo did you bother to read the post I was replying to ? Or do you just read mine? Your obsession is showing.

Glorianny your obsession is showing.
I’ve read the thread, not just your posts. I’ve asked some questions about what you wrote.
Your reply is to attack. Nothing new there.

May I ask you all to read this article carefully and seriously, including Clarkson's own daughter's remarks on her own father?

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2022/dec/19/violent-misogynic-fantasies-meghan-jeremy-clarkson-sun

I have come out of an abusive marriage last year of 11 years where misogynist abuse was a regular feature, if low key: police arrests for same: I have lovely Quaker Male friends, and a first Ex who liked women - but Clarkson is, to me, well beyond the pale and just gives men like him space to feel its OK to be as they are.

If you want to criticise people, do it on the basis of what they have done as a person, a human being, do not use misogeny to perpetrate the worst of what many women fact day after day at home and in the workplace.

I'm glad you personally didn't find that at work, GSM, but it's not a reason for criticism of those who want to call Clarkson out.

Mollygo

*I’m really delighted to find that so many on here think that sexism is not OK.*

I’ve never rated Jeremy Clarkson, though I did find him a better Top Gear presenter than the IMO self-obsessed Freddie Flintoff.
I’m surprised there hasn’t been more objections to the film he’s said to be copying.
Whilst what Jeremy said was very unpleasant, if no one’s been up in arms about saying that in a film that they have evidently watched and not complained about why suddenly attack him?

I’m surprised there hasn’t been more objections to the film he’s said to be copying

He should have had more sense than to repeat such rubbish, using a fictional scenario to illustrate his dislike of a living person.
That was very unpleasant and cruel.

I'm astonished, too, that the series hasn't received more censure.
Apparently Game of Thrones is extremely popular with many people, not just men, so I'm surprised.

I've never watched it so cannot judge apart from the few snippets I've heard about it, including this one. It's surprising that such a hotbed of misogyny is so universally popular.

As I'm not into cars I don't like Top Gear but we did watch Jeremy's Farm and liked the way he brought the plight of farmers to public notice.

A lot of women enjoy supporting hatred and threats towards other women and I suspect there are a lot of violent men hiding behind that support and laughing at the women they are shielded by.

Callistemon21 Game of Thrones was an adaption of the series of books A Song of Ice and Fire by James R R Martin.

Some of the strongest and most violent characters were female, there was brutality, sex, violent war scenes along with family dynamics, there was not an overwhelming sense of misogyny.

Thanks GrannyGravy

Never read it, never watched it
I do notice that quiz programmes often include questions about it, as if we are all devotees and that is is general knowledge.
It's not.

Ps It sounds vile.

Mollygo as you plainly didn't understand my reply to GSM I've broken it down into the relevant points as answers to your questions.
Mg Of course many women maintain cordial relationships with men. Didn’t you know that?
I’ve been saying for a long time that the patriarchy exists. So have many others.

Where has anyone been saying that it doesn’t?
Who was it?
GSM I don’t have a warped view of men despite a very unhappy first marriage. I have no reason to think of men as the patriarchy or the enemy
Me The patriarchy of course exists. Denying it does so or that it controls and denigrates women still is completely unsupported by the evidence
Mg Of course many women maintain cordial relationships with men. Didn’t you know that?
GSM*I don’t have a warped view of men* That may well have been why I succeeded and am less than popular with dyed in the wool feminists than with men
Me The old fashioned and out of date view that feminists somehow have it in for men and don't get on with them is really ridiculous. Many women manage to believe abusing women is wrong but maintain very cordial relationships with men.

Hope this helps simplify things for you

Callistemon21

Ps It sounds vile.

It is vile.

I confess to having read all the books, mainly because I'm a compulsive reader with an ardent wish to know What Happened in the End. But I found them quite disgusting in places (and frankly unbelievable that anyone could survive the violence meted out to them...)

But most adults know that fiction doesn't always reflect reality, especially when it consists of lots of violence porn. Clarkson was bang out of order with that vile piece.

The patriarchy, controlling and denigrating women. We must have reverted to mediaeval times when I wasn’t watching. 🙄

Germanshepherdsmum

The patriarchy, controlling and denigrating women. We must have reverted to mediaeval times when I wasn’t watching. 🙄

Of course not all women Gsm some of them choose to ally themselves with the patriarchal system and do quite nicely. But you have a legal background. You must know that women are treated worse than men in the judicial system.
Baroness Corston was commissioned by the Government to carry out a review of women with particular vulnerabilities in the criminal justice system. Her subsequent report argued that “Women have been marginalised within a system largely designed by men for men for far too long and there is a need for a “champion” to ensure that their needs are properly recognised and met”.23 The report further argued that:

Equality must embrace not just fairness but also inclusivity. This will result in some different services and policies for men and women. There are fundamental differences between male and female offenders and those at risk of offending that indicate a different and distinct approach is needed for women
Others recognise the control still exercised by men even if you don't

You’ve come out with that before and I have responded to it.

Germanshepherdsmum

You’ve come out with that before and I have responded to it.

You haven't explained how this isn't an example of the patriarchy still operating GSM but I suppose you would have difficulty, after all Baroness Corston says it is, and she was a barrister.

I’ve never liked Jeremy Clarkson, rarely watched Top Gear because of his style, think that his remarks about Meghan, who I don’t particularly like either, were downright nasty and should not have been printed, but I’m not sure it was sexism.

25Avalon

I’ve never liked Jeremy Clarkson, rarely watched Top Gear because of his style, think that his remarks about Meghan, who I don’t particularly like either, were downright nasty and should not have been printed, but I’m not sure it was sexism.

It sounded more like hate speech to me, Avalon.

True MaizieD now you say it was very much a hate speech but sexism? It backfired on him colossally. It offended most decent people with it’s vitriol.

There are almost 70 million people in the UK, half of which are women. Why would one person think their experience is somehow a baseline representation for anyone else?

How many women have missed out on jobs or promotions because they might get pregnant or have children?

How many women have come across a guy who thinks he is owed sex because he held a door open?

How many women have made a friend to find he is complaining about being in the friend zone because he stupidly thinks all women belong in the girlfriend zone.

How many women have been touched without their consent or sent a picture of a penis like they are supposed to be impressed?

You only have to look at the pink tax which still stands at women's things being about a third more expensive than men's to see how we are disadvantaged on a daily basis.

Even school uniform is more expensive for girls which is a terrible start to life

Your obsession is showing Glorianny.

Germanshepherdsmum

A great and momentous victory for women? Twaddle. He was rude about her (though I did find his piece amusing). End of.

oh "end of" That means of course that YOU must be right and everyone else wrong

A good summary of 'Game of Thrones' GrannyGravy and as you say some of the strongest and most violent characters were women.

For me Clarkson's rant was hate speech rather than sexism.

The picture in people's heads that Clarkson conjured up, was revolting. In schools we already have a problems of the Andrew Tate variety about male perceptions of female behaviour and a woman's place in their world. This picture just added to them.
So yes. I am revolted by this man's article being written about any named woman, regardless of his 'clever' nod to popular culture, understood by millions, but going over the heads of tens of millions.

GSM , yesterday " crowing feminist " - unpleasant and unnecessary.