Bonus Holes..as an alternative to a vagina.

This isn't an erasure of the correct language but a different term for those that want it.

Exactly

I would have thought a bonus hole was the nineteenth hole offering a long gin and tonic after a boring game of a golf.

BeverleyJB

icanhandthemback

Smileless2012

Well I think it's ridiculous and don't understand why trans men and non binary people would have a problem using the correct terminology.

Because language counts. If you identify as non-binary, you may not want a fundamentally female label for your body parts. It won't hurt us to take this into account as long as 'we', people who identify as biologically female, aren't affected. I am quite happy to be kind to people who have different thoughts to me as long as I am not being asked to compromise my beliefs.

Exactly - language DOES count and it's the erasure of correct language that dehumanises women.

And these people “who have different thoughts to you” should absolutely not be permitted to demand that others deny reality, including biological reality, just because they can.

But we are assured that this does not extend to our bodies therefore our correct language is not being erased. There are other words such as Cis or birthing people where I would agree with you through and through because they are directed at us. If language matter to us which it does, then we have to accept it matters to people who live their lives with different gender identifications so if they want to call their body parts something different, why should we object? This isn't an erasure of the correct language but a different term for those that want it. The day my GP refers to my vagina as a bonus hole, glory hole or any other sort of hole, I will be offended and will let him know so in no uncertain terms!
There are so many things we need to protect in this new world but somebody else's labels for them, is not something to waste much sleep over.

I agree with the feeling that we can't open our mouths without causing offence icanhandthemback but as I've already posted, why was there a need to make this public?

I share your concerns although IMO the thin end of the wedge was in evidence some time ago. I do see this as being directed at all women because all women have vaginas, and very few I'm sure would ever wish them to be referred too as bonus holes.

icanhandthemback

Smileless2012

Well I think it's ridiculous and don't understand why trans men and non binary people would have a problem using the correct terminology.

Because language counts. If you identify as non-binary, you may not want a fundamentally female label for your body parts. It won't hurt us to take this into account as long as 'we', people who identify as biologically female, aren't affected. I am quite happy to be kind to people who have different thoughts to me as long as I am not being asked to compromise my beliefs.

Exactly - language DOES count and it's the erasure of correct language that dehumanises women.

And these people “who have different thoughts to you” should absolutely not be permitted to demand that others deny reality, including biological reality, just because they can.

I would only be offended if my vagina was labelled thus, Smileless2012. I think we have to careful that people can't open their mouths without somebody being offended which it sometimes feels like. As long as it is literally for those who to use such a term or even better an alternative, I don't think women should be up in arms about it. It should only be offensive surely to those of whom it is directed and we are assured that it isn't us. However, it worries me that it might be the thin end of the wedge which all these things appear to be.

Yes I take your point icanhandthemback and of course people can refer to their body parts in anyway they choose but why do we need to know that some are calling their vaginas 'bonus holes'? Why has a charity supposedly dedicated to women's health made this public? Surely this would be between a patient and their health care provider.

Women who find this term offensive have been affected because it's caused offence.

We should all stick together on this subject. We are women and we have vaginas, I will not be allowing this dreadful use of an organ that delivered my children described in this disgusting manner. Enough is enough.

icanhandthemback

^The actual context is trying to find a term trans men and non binary people feel comfortable using in order to help them feel confident seeking medical treatment.^

Fair enough but surely they could come up with a better term than this which is misogynistic and will inevitably be used by men for a born woman. If somebody really feels they are a woman and has taken such steps to have the surgery, they would understand that it is inappropriate. Similarly, woman who transitioned to be a man would appreciate just how misogynistic the world is for women. Any decent Non-binary person should appreciate that too.

.

Unfortunately, some women who claim to be trans or nonbinary do have such a demeaning attitude to their own bodies.

I'd guess it's a result of too much exposure to porn at a young age, to misogynistic attitudes of men surrounding them and, possibly, to sexual abuse in childhood.

It's difficult to believe at times that this type of news report isn't some sort of unpleasant joke. Why can't people shut up about their bodies and their sexuality, both of which should be a private matter for the individual, or the individual and partner(s). Ask their family, friends and associates to call them whatever they choose to be called, and then get on with the life they want to lead. This particular situation is grossly offensive to me, born, and living, as a woman, with a woman's body. 'Bonus hole'? Whose ugly and stupid idea was this? It is easy to feel bullied and marginalised just from the media reports, and we shouldn't have to feel this way.

Smileless2012

Well I think it's ridiculous and don't understand why trans men and non binary people would have a problem using the correct terminology.

Because language counts. If you identify as non-binary, you may not want a fundamentally female label for your body parts. It won't hurt us to take this into account as long as 'we', people who identify as biologically female, aren't affected. I am quite happy to be kind to people who have different thoughts to me as long as I am not being asked to compromise my beliefs.

Well I think it's ridiculous and don't understand why trans men and non binary people would have a problem using the correct terminology.

The actual context is trying to find a term trans men and non binary people feel comfortable using in order to help them feel confident seeking medical treatment.

Fair enough but surely they could come up with a better term than this which is misogynistic and will inevitably be used by men for a born woman. If somebody really feels they are a woman and has taken such steps to have the surgery, they would understand that it is inappropriate. Similarly, woman who transitioned to be a man would appreciate just how misogynistic the world is for women. Any decent Non-binary person should appreciate that too.

Jeez this world is nuts, we've gone so far now I'm losing hope for our normality, but maybe this is the normality now? Well I don't like it!!!

Seen on twitter :

"If women who pretend to be gay men have a 'bonus hole', does that mean men who pretend to be lesbians have a 'bonus pole'?"

(Of course, neither of those is a bonus to actual gay men or lesbians.)

Not only daft but intrusive.

I was asked to fill in an evaluation form at the end of an excellent outdoor performance tonight by some great young actors.

One of the the questions said ‘female, male, rather not say’ then it said ‘how do you feel about your gender’? I wrote ‘Female 100%!!’ What a bloomin’ daft irrelevant question at a show. They will be asking questions like that at the chemist, coffee shop, supermarket next 😏

Maybe. .
I guess not many will be using the term then!

I think they would be bi rather than gay to fancy sex with someone who has the feel of a woman’s body (I mean the whole soft curve thing) and then a vagina.

I mean that’s just what doesn’t appeal to gay men.

Unless you are now a gay man who has not had surgery. DiamondLily

We do get a uretha too.

Is that retained or diverted?

The more I think about it the more I’m convinced that mucking about with body parts like this can’t be a good idea.

Lathyrus

I thought it was trans men who had retained their vagina too.

Either way, no one has a "bonus hole".

Biological men have an anus.

Biological women have a vagina and an anus.

Nobody gets extra, as far as I know.🥴

Iam64

NanKate, it was standard advice here in the north west - maybe nationally

Yes, my (London) Nan always used that term.😉

I thought it was trans men who had retained their vagina too.

maddyone

Why don’t they just call it a trans vagina? We all know it’s not a real one because it’s been created by doctors but I don’t know why they don’t just describe what it is. If they go to a doctor with a problem with it, they’ll just have to say that’s it’s a trans vagina. The doctor won’t care, but will need to know the full facts to treat.

I understood this was a "bonus" for trans men in the gay community.

Have I just got that all wrong?