Where has the money gone?

MaizieD
Yes, where has the money gone.
Is nobody talking about it. I’m going to search and see if anyone is. Crafty bastards.

I’ve thought this for a long time!

I can’t remember the details, but recently I read a piece about what the writer evidently thought is a hugely bloated civil service* with masses of CSs on £100k plus salaries, and presumably pensions to match.

*Especially when compared to its efficiency, was the tone of the piece. It was in the Times or the Sunday Times, can’t remember though.

So that’d be at least one drop in the squillion quid ocean.

Furlough wasn’t a cheap exercise neither was subsidising energy bills over the winter months.

Pandemic/Ukraine plus energy crisis/Brexit/transition to net zero etc

I am absolutely not an apologist for the government and the tories but getting through Covid cost a fortune. Support for businesses, for employees, PPE (that's a whole different discussion), development of the vaccine, loss of income through lost revenue in taxes, and so the list goes on. Not to say the money was always spent wisely, competently or effectively but the money had to be raised from somewhere.

Witzend

I can’t remember the details, but recently I read a piece about what the writer evidently thought is a hugely bloated civil service* with masses of CSs on £100k plus salaries, and presumably pensions to match.

*Especially when compared to its efficiency, was the tone of the piece. It was in the Times or the Sunday Times, can’t remember though.

So that’d be at least one drop in the squillion quid ocean.

Telegraph says
'2,050 mandarins now take home six-figure salaries'
www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2023/08/09/rise-in-senior-civil-service-whitehall-pay-freeze/

Not to say the money was always spent wisely, competently or effectively but the money had to be raised from somewhere

Does this include the dosh that the criminal fraudsters in whitehall passed under the table to their mates for duff merchandise?

Michelle Mone has had quite a chunk hasn't she?

Not to mention Quantitive Easing that devalued the currency and contributed to inflation.

GrannyGravy13

Furlough wasn’t a cheap exercise neither was subsidising energy bills over the winter months.

Yes, GG13, but the money for the cost of living help primarily ended up as bumper profits for the energy companies and supermarkets. To be paid as dividend to mostly already wealthy shareholders who have done nothing to justify the increase.

And don't try to justify the covid money pouring into the hands of tory friends and donors for the provision of worthless PPE. Isn't it something like £11billions worth which has to be destroyed because it was unusable? Or companies fraudulently obtaining loans. That was a few £billions as well.

I'm afraid some high civil service salaries amount to nowhere near the scale of these... (no, I know you didn't mention them, but someone has)

But this extra money apart, where has the rest gone? It plainly hasn't gone on public services and infrastructure because they have been continuously cut back over the past 13 years. And that includes the civil service.

M0nica

Not to mention Quantitive Easing that devalued the currency and contributed to inflation.

No it hasn't, MOnica.

QE started in 2008 to rescue the banks, more in 2016 to boost the £ after the Brexit vote and the last lot for covid. None of which caused inflation, which remained pretty stable around the 2% mark until last year.

Actually, I tell a lie. The 2008 round of QE caused asset price inflation. Bonds and shares and high end property. Nothing to affect CPI or RPI.

Chardy

Witzend

I can’t remember the details, but recently I read a piece about what the writer evidently thought is a hugely bloated civil service* with masses of CSs on £100k plus salaries, and presumably pensions to match.

*Especially when compared to its efficiency, was the tone of the piece. It was in the Times or the Sunday Times, can’t remember though.

So that’d be at least one drop in the squillion quid ocean.

Telegraph says
'2,050 mandarins now take home six-figure salaries'
www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2023/08/09/rise-in-senior-civil-service-whitehall-pay-freeze/

I suspect the Civil Service is only contributing very marginally to the overspend. I queried comparison Civil Servants 2010 with now, and although there are some increases they are relatively recent, and there was a big reduction in the middle period, which should have saved money. Look at the graph for a quick ready reckoner.
www.instituteforgovernment.org.uk/explainer/civil-service-staff-numbers

The reason given for the high salaries paid at the top of the state and charity sector is that their pay should be commensurate with that of those a the top of the private sector.

Dinahmo

The reason given for the high salaries paid at the top of the state and charity sector is that their pay should be commensurate with that of those a the top of the private sector.

And of course that position hasn’t changed in the last 13 years, it was already part of the terms and conditions of service.

t we need to do is limit the inflationary pay rises given to company directors.

I think that pay rises for senior staff and directors, once they sign on, should be limited to the average for all staff in the company in the same country. Directors should be tax domiciled in the country they work in. Bonuses should be an equal % for all staff.

Yes, I know salaries for the directors of international companies needs to meet international averages, but many companies are based entirely in the UK, so international comparisons do not come into it, and many such companies are subsiduaries of larger companies and the same rules apply.

What is not clear to me is that the Tories say public sector wage increases drive up inflation yet they ignore the larger private sector increases for directors and employees. Their refusal to talk with the junior doctors is costing patients' lives and extending the NHS waiting list as well as wasting billions on covering for strike absences.

Public sector wages don't drive up inflation because they are not manufacturing or buying and selling services or stuff.

The Tories have told so many untruths over the years that people believe them.

Jill Foot (wife of Michael) said that Labour would never win an election until they learned to fight as dirty as the Conservatives. There is an element of truth in that.

Money has been extracted from the economy over the years by the Tory party by means of high taxation, and debt. The government has ensured that money creation has been cut year on year thus ensuring that public services are cut to the bone.

They've extracted money but where has it gone?

Ping! Gone 😄😄. So the government creates money and can do the opposite. What’s the opposite to creates?

I’ve been (slowly) reading about this.

Dinahmo

They've extracted money but where has it gone?

I don't think it's so much 'extracted' as it has been paid out to someone or something, but it certainly wasn't the public sector, they've been cutting that like mad. And it's not ending up in the domestic economy or that would be growing. Which it isn't.

I’d start with the banks. Look at the high interest rates and the profits they have made this year for example.