Is it never going to stop?

The quote is from the victimscommissioner.org. I states in the year 2021 there were 67,125 rape offences recorded

Office for national statistics - the volume of sexual offences recorded by the police has been increasing over the last decade although the numbers remain well below the number of victims estimated in the survey. .. figures for year ending March 2022 show an increase of 31% to 195,566 police recorded offences compared to the previous year
So increased reports, decreased convictions

Surely though, they can only be offences if proven?

I can understand increased reports but decreased convictions - it is frequently the case that the complainant has been in a relationship with the accused, which can be proved through mobile phone records if the complainant permits their phone to be taken for analysis - which many don’t - and that makes it difficult for a jury to decide beyond all reasonable doubt that the offence was committed. It can also be a reason for the CPS declining to authorise a prosecution. It’s not difficult to prove forensically that intercourse occurred, but very difficult in the absence of witnesses or injuries to the complainant or tearing of clothes to prove beyond reasonable doubt that it was not consensual.

Yes I do understand the complexity. My point stands though, it’s vanishingly rare for a rapist to be convicted

I can’t call someone a rapist unless they have been convicted. Juries don’t convict unless satisfied beyond reasonable doubt that the offence was committed, and (rightly) the CPS don’t authorise prosecution unless they believe there is a good prospect of conviction.

My memory is that the cps won’t authorise prosecution unless they believe at least 80-85% prospect of conviction. My work experience led me to be sadly well aware that sex offenders are rarely successfully prosecuted. I m ‘beyond reasonable doubt ‘ is necessary. The difficulty often is proving that.

It’s particularly difficult where the woman has been in a relationship with the man, which is often the case. I agree with the CPS’s threshold for authorising a prosecution. Taking an iffy case to court just clogs the courts up further and wastes public money.

My husband was on a jury some years ago. There were two rape cases, neither resulted in convictions. Both the women were in relationships with the men involved and had behaved in such a way as to make conviction extremely unlikely.

no disagreement between us on this gsm. It’s a difficult subject.
convictions are vanishingly rare. Rape is not

Well isn't it true, you are innocent till proven guilty? We'll have to wait and see, it's not looking good though is it 😕

Many women have their lives ruined for no reason because someone rapes them. Most of them never get justice because it’s so hard to prove. Innocent until proven guilty is not the same for sexual offences. Jimmy Savile was never prosecuted in a court of law, just saying.

Germanshepherdsmum

I can’t call someone a rapist unless they have been convicted. Juries don’t convict unless satisfied beyond reasonable doubt that the offence was committed, and (rightly) the CPS don’t authorise prosecution unless they believe there is a good prospect of conviction.

So Jimmy Savile wasn’t a rapist then?

Wasn’t he dead by the time what he had been doing came out? You can’t try a corpse

I wanted to add a short story Of why the predators get away for lots of reasons and they don’t get caught out. The low levels of court prosecutors are reflective of the court system too. I have sat on 3 juries so seen first hand how things are in court .
I was raped with the help of a Ritalin type drug on the night of my 16 th birthday decades ago in a house local to me. They said we were gonna have a party for me on a school night It was the brother of a so called boyfriend who had colluded together for it to happen. I never had a boyfriend before then.
I thought it was my fault ! They were both 7 or 8 years older than me and I was’ dating’ one of the brothers. Obviously with hindsight I was groomed at the school Gate. In year 10. So fallout is no 0 levels. All U grade. off rails a bit, risky behaviour, other predators around too , no university like siblings for me, no trust in anyone etc etc. and no proper falling in love and boyfriends. It’s been a hard road to go on.

so I reported it this year and the police were very good. They interviewed the brother at the station and I had never seen him since that Thursday night
To cut a long story short he admitted remembering me. [ well after a bit of pressure] he said just touching me not rape, and so I’ve been encouraged to go legal forward.
The Cps they concluded would most likely take the case to court.
After a long hard think I ve decided that I may lose and I’d prefer him looking over his shoulder for next 20 plus years incase things change and I do testify or others do.

To those ppl around. who ask why take so long to report it? Basically it take guts / courage to tell at the time [ and now too ] and mostly [ like my parents ] didn’t actually care what went on I my life. anyway or actually believe me.
So I ignored it. Of course it’s not forgotten but now I feel happier knowing I done right thing. Who knows he may have other girls they planned to do this too . It’s not a straight forward thing. T bh. I support rape charities where possible. I agree it’s hard to get convictions as rape is a crime that generally ! has no witnesses so yes it’s under reported I feel brave now and it does not matter when Or how long ago it took place it’s better to report if you are able and want to get some closure.

"Is it never going to stop"?? Well, in answer to your history-free question, NO!!

Politicos, Royals, elected Presidents, Union Leaders, etc etc, any and all who either get elected to power, or are born into it, may all be corrupt, incompetent and/or just evil (oh, and for that, add in a few despots who just seized that power). Oops, and I nearly forgot, some Church leaders who got appointed and then, shall we say, lost their way?!

Doesn't mean they all are, but a subset, certainly fail one or more of those tests.

It's been going on for many centuries, right round the planet, and won't be stopping anytime soon. Depressing isn't it?!

Innocent until proved guilty. Another swipe at the Conservatives! I hold no brief for Crispin Blunt. However, he named himself and hints at blackmail ( he had approached the police about it beforehand) so all we can do is wait and see.

Now, those of you who would support Labour, can you tell us what happened to the Labour MP Nick Brown? I have read that currently he is persona non grata in the party and has not been seen around the. Commons. Maybe you can turn your gossip towards him. Then there is the plagiarism accusation against Rachel Reeves. Have I missed the thread about her?

I found a link. He has been under investigation FOR A YEAR!!!

www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-tyne-66738602

Anniel

I found a link. He has been under investigation FOR A YEAR!!!

www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-tyne-66738602

Don't the tories have one who has been under investigation for a year or more, too?

I'd suggest that you are scraping the barrel for Labour misdeeds whereas the tory's seem to follow each other like London buses...

Those on the left don’t like to publicise the possible wrongdoings of their own, Anniel.

At least Blunt named himself and told of the previous attempts at blackmail by his accuser. He says he’s confident he won’t be charged - I hope he’s right.

Germanshepherdsmum

Those on the left don’t like to publicise the possible wrongdoings of their own, Anniel.

At least Blunt named himself and told of the previous attempts at blackmail by his accuser. He says he’s confident he won’t be charged - I hope he’s right.

Can I just remind you of the previous thread about this
www.gransnet.com/forums/news_and_politics/1328765-Peter-Bone
That’s a very unfair comment from you Germanshepherdsmum, most of us regardless of political persuasion condemn inappropriate behaviour by anybody. I feel quite offended to be tarred with a brush of avoiding discussions about MPs on the left who have committed this type of offence.

I’m sorry if I have offended you Casdon, but there is an almost gleeful jumping on any hint of wrongdoing by a Conservative MP.

My first reaction to the title was rain! Will it ever stop?

Germanshepherdsmum

I’m sorry if I have offended you Casdon, but there is an almost gleeful jumping on any hint of wrongdoing by a Conservative MP.

Not by those of us of whichever party who recognise that the party has nothing to do with the deed there isn’t. I’d suggest that is the majority.

maddyone

A member of my extended family was charged with rape. The accusation came from his very vindictive ex wife. He was suspended from his job as a result (police). We all believed him to be innocent as he claimed because we were well aware of his ex wife’s behaviour. It took over a year for it to come to trial. A year of hell for him. He was found to be innocent.

Do not be so quick to judge until you know the facts.

Whilst I have the utmost sympathy for any woman who has been assaulted it is important to realise that there are many reasons why women accuse men, some of them genuine, some vindictive and some mercenary.
I agree that it is wrong to assume guilt at this stage, mud sticks even if no charges are eventually brought or if the accused person is found innocent.

I have lost track but I think it was this thead where I said that the idea that political party has anything to do with these offences was a particularly dangerous idea.

Yes Galaxy, but WWM2 constantly starts threads about the Conservatives and although my party is in real trouble and I make no secret of my belief that Labour will come to power at the next election , I dislike the way WWM2 plus her supporters spend a lot of time blaming the government without considering the current economic problems besetting Western Democracies.. Poor Sir Keir will find it hard to find the money to increase funds to health, education and social services the Left want.