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Homelessness is a lifestyle choice according to Suella!

(182 Posts)
CvD66 Sun 05-Nov-23 12:26:17

Under this Tory period in power, homelessness has increased by 75% (271k in Jan 2023 according to Shelter) due in part to high rents and other costs of living, reduced mental and social service support and other Tory cuts. Our beloved Home Sec has decided homelessness is a lifestyle choice. In addition to her natural callousness, she now intends to prevent charities from giving tents to homeless people. Has this woman no grams of human kindness?
Notably under the last Labour government, homeless figures fell from just over 100k to 50k

BlueBelle Sun 05-Nov-23 12:28:29

Has this woman no grams of human kindness?
No not even a smidgen I m alright Jack She s a caricature of a human
Hateful hopefully she ll be gone soon I sincerely hope 🤞🏼

GrannyGravy13 Sun 05-Nov-23 12:35:50

I think the main problem is that the majority of hostels and/or temporary accommodation will not allow those with alcohol or drug addictions in. If these troubled souls could and indeed want to access help for their addictions it is a step in the right direction.

People with addictions have to want to be helped, it is impossible to help an addict if they are unwilling, whether they be on the pavement or in a mansion.

I have read more than just the headline , what she implied was that we shouldn’t allow tent cities to pop up in and around our major cities. This is not an unreasonable want in the 21st Century.

MayBee70 Sun 05-Nov-23 12:37:27

She’s comparing the UK with San Francisco which does have a problem with rough sleepers. But the problem with San Francisco is it’s part of a country that doesn’t have a NHS or, from what I can gather, a social care system. Has it occurred to her that this country, thanks to her government, is going the same way as America. I still can’t get my head around her comments. As Home Secretary she’s making Priti Patel look like Mother Theresa. I was told recently but haven’t checked the validity if it that, when a refugee is granted settled status they then have 7 days to find new accommodation etc. I don’t know how much help (if any) they receive. As James O’Brien said, there’s a problem with homeless people living in tents so this governments solution is ‘take away the tents’! Almost unbelievable. And this woman is a Buddhist!

Witzend Sun 05-Nov-23 12:45:29

While God knows I’m no fan of the Tories, can I just point out that buy to let (and therefore private landlord-ism) first began to boom under Gordon Brown, when he abolished mortgage interest relief for owner occupiers, but retained it for buy to let.

And despite their endless moaning about it, Labour had 13 years during which to repeal the Right to Buy act, but they didn’t.

I can only think that they thought that a boom in private rentals would absolve them from any need to take too much action over providing new social housing, or maintaining what there already was.

Of course nobody foresaw the massive rise in house prices and now rents, too, not that these are by any means confined to the U.K.

MaizieD Sun 05-Nov-23 12:47:45

I have read more than just the headline , what she implied was that we shouldn’t allow tent cities to pop up in and around our major cities. This is not an unreasonable want in the 21st Century.

Taking the tents away isn't going to do anything to stop the rough sleepers, it'll just be cardboard box cities instead.

Germanshepherdsmum Sun 05-Nov-23 12:54:20

I think she actually said that in many cases homelessness is a lifestyle choice, and I would agree with that - there are people who don’t want to have a fixed abode, often for reasons of mental health. There are places where a tent would be positively dangerous, and there is also the argument that it’s impossible to know what is going on inside and whether the occupant needs medical attention. I can see both sides of this, and no we don’t want encampments springing up in cities.

maddyone Sun 05-Nov-23 12:57:08

I think drugs and alcoholism are at the root of this. I don’t know what the answer is though.

Dinahmo Sun 05-Nov-23 13:30:49

Witzend

While God knows I’m no fan of the Tories, can I just point out that buy to let (and therefore private landlord-ism) first began to boom under Gordon Brown, when he abolished mortgage interest relief for owner occupiers, but retained it for buy to let.

And despite their endless moaning about it, Labour had 13 years during which to repeal the Right to Buy act, but they didn’t.

I can only think that they thought that a boom in private rentals would absolve them from any need to take too much action over providing new social housing, or maintaining what there already was.

Of course nobody foresaw the massive rise in house prices and now rents, too, not that these are by any means confined to the U.K.

Tax relief for landlords was kept because they were running a business. If I, as a business owner, decide to buy premises for my business, I am entitled to claim mortgage interest at my marginal tax rate. Tax relief for landlords was restricted to the BR w.e.f April 2017 and the method in which the relief was given has gradually changed.

MayBee70 Sun 05-Nov-23 13:32:04

It’s easy to get into a downward spiral. If you don’t have an address you can’t claim for anything. If you don’t have a phone or a computer you can’t claim fir anything. I suggest that everyone that thinks living on the streets is a lifestyle choice watches I Daniel Blake.

Oldbat1 Sun 05-Nov-23 13:35:28

Thatcher selling council houses has a lot to answer for.

MayBee70 Sun 05-Nov-23 13:36:25

Germanshepherdsmum

I think she actually said that in many cases homelessness is a lifestyle choice, and I would agree with that - there are people who don’t want to have a fixed abode, often for reasons of mental health. There are places where a tent would be positively dangerous, and there is also the argument that it’s impossible to know what is going on inside and whether the occupant needs medical attention. I can see both sides of this, and no we don’t want encampments springing up in cities.

So you’re saying that it is in the best interests of a homeless person to sleep in a cardboard box rather than a tent in case they have a medical emergency? Do you not just think that Braverman just thinks that tents just make the problem more obvious? She’s also saying that most of these homeless people are foreigners. I’d like to see some statistics to back that up.

Germanshepherdsmum Sun 05-Nov-23 13:39:04

There are some homeless people who don’t want to be part of society or claim benefits MayBee. They want to live life on their own terms. Just some, not all of course.

JaneJudge Sun 05-Nov-23 13:39:07

I want to post what I want to post without minimising homelessness as I think rough sleeping and being homeless or being in inadequate temporary housing is a massive issue BUT I think there is a percentage or proportion of people who live in their cars/vans and wash at service stations etc and it is a choice so they can make money/work cash in hand and then move back to their own countries with their money (I know a few people like this through my own work and previous work, they are/were all men) that's the only people I know who do it as a choice and I don't think it is ideal

CvD66 Sun 05-Nov-23 13:54:54

Germanshepherdsmum & grannygravy - to dismiss 271,000 people as having addiction problems or not wanting to be part of society, are both sweeping generalisations. This problem cannot be dismissed merely as being the homeless person's fault although that is what Ms Braverman would have you believe!

MaizieD Sun 05-Nov-23 13:58:06

Very interesting twitter thread here about what Milton Keynes has done to help homeless in their area:

twitter.com/emily4MK/status/1721149388582531093

Clue; It wasn't by taking away their tents

MaizieD Sun 05-Nov-23 13:58:57

P.S if people can't access it I'll copy & paste it

Cfaz49 Sun 05-Nov-23 14:00:35

I have a son who is one step away from the streets. At the moment he is sofa surfing. He has just had a serious back operation and is awaiting a gastric op for complicated diverticulitis and other problems. His doctor and advisor at the benefit’s office are trying to get him some accommodation. He was a gardener by trade. Not an addict and pretty much teetotal. But…. Male, single and sick… not a chance of any sort of help from anyone in the housing department. It’s a very short step for all of us from a home to the streets.

GrannyGravy13 Sun 05-Nov-23 14:01:12

CvD66

Germanshepherdsmum & grannygravy - to dismiss 271,000 people as having addiction problems or not wanting to be part of society, are both sweeping generalisations. This problem cannot be dismissed merely as being the homeless person's fault although that is what Ms Braverman would have you believe!

Sorry, but I didn’t dismiss 271,000 people.

I merely pointed out a fact that hostels will not take addicts.

There are many homeless who are on the streets through no fault of their own, loss of jobs, marriage/relationship breakdown along with teenage runaways.

There should in the 21st Century be help available, I do not want to see tent villages in and around our towns like they have in the USA and France to name just two countries who also have a problem.

MayBee70 Sun 05-Nov-23 14:38:46

JaneJudge

I want to post what I want to post without minimising homelessness as I think rough sleeping and being homeless or being in inadequate temporary housing is a massive issue BUT I think there is a percentage or proportion of people who live in their cars/vans and wash at service stations etc and it is a choice so they can make money/work cash in hand and then move back to their own countries with their money (I know a few people like this through my own work and previous work, they are/were all men) that's the only people I know who do it as a choice and I don't think it is ideal

Oh, so it is down to foreigners again hmm…Of course…

silverlining48 Sun 05-Nov-23 14:39:49

Many homeless people were in care, I knew quite a number who joined the military at 16 when they were discharged from care.
It’s well known that children in care rarely succeed in the education system. This is often due to frequent moves to new areas and changes in foster carers. When care finishes there is little support and people often struggle for many reasons. Life gets chaotic and they may become homeless, or end up in and out of prison. It’s all very sad.
CvD66 I hope your son gets some help. Single adults have more problems with housing. The sale of council housing with huge discounts has a lot to answer fir.

Dickens Sun 05-Nov-23 14:43:58

Maybe it's a "lifestyle choice" in the sense that if you have no home and no friend or family's sofa to sleep on - it's the only choice left?

Grantanow Sun 05-Nov-23 14:47:13

I doubt Braverman is motivated by concern for tent dwellers. I think she is throwing 'red meat' to the Tory faithful, blimpish half-Colonels, blue rinses and the like. Most of her controversial pronouncements are to keep immigration, rough sleepers and similar issues to the forefront of Tory voters' minds for the General Election, to attract far-right voters who otherwise vote for Tice's Party and for her Leadership bid thereafter. I doubt Sunak will sack her because she says the things to keep the faithful interested which he doesn't want to say so as not to put off swing voters.

Whitewavemark2 Sun 05-Nov-23 14:52:34

Grantanow

I doubt Braverman is motivated by concern for tent dwellers. I think she is throwing 'red meat' to the Tory faithful, blimpish half-Colonels, blue rinses and the like. Most of her controversial pronouncements are to keep immigration, rough sleepers and similar issues to the forefront of Tory voters' minds for the General Election, to attract far-right voters who otherwise vote for Tice's Party and for her Leadership bid thereafter. I doubt Sunak will sack her because she says the things to keep the faithful interested which he doesn't want to say so as not to put off swing voters.

Yes

MerylStreep Sun 05-Nov-23 15:10:30

MayBee70

She’s comparing the UK with San Francisco which does have a problem with rough sleepers. But the problem with San Francisco is it’s part of a country that doesn’t have a NHS or, from what I can gather, a social care system. Has it occurred to her that this country, thanks to her government, is going the same way as America. I still can’t get my head around her comments. As Home Secretary she’s making Priti Patel look like Mother Theresa. I was told recently but haven’t checked the validity if it that, when a refugee is granted settled status they then have 7 days to find new accommodation etc. I don’t know how much help (if any) they receive. As James O’Brien said, there’s a problem with homeless people living in tents so this governments solution is ‘take away the tents’! Almost unbelievable. And this woman is a Buddhist!

I know that was the case some years ago.
I was in the room with the asylum seeker when he was told you have to find your own accommodation now