Would the Tories dare to hoist yet another prime minister onto the country?

Nothing is unthinkable to a Tory government with it's back against the wall.

They wouldn't though, would they ronib? Wouldn't they put in letters?

ronib

I have not heard any Conservatives call for Sunak to resign. I think it’s much more subtle. It could be just that whoever is running the party has lost the plot. It is a bit unfortunate that Sunak reminds me of a puppet in appearance but that is in part due to the way he is filmed, I guess?

They have though.
m.youtube.com/watch?v=EOFnxkNTH7U
This was on GB News. Braverman very nearly said it when she resigned too. The tensions are on the surface, so today will be interesting. I don’t think he will resign, the more moderate MPs are the majority and they know he’s the best chance they have at the moment.

Plus turkeys (MPs) are not going to vote for Christmas. The Tory MPs know their days in Westminster are numbered. They are likely to cling on for as long as possible. They enjoy all the trappings. Why give it up sooner when it might as well be after the summer? “Make hay while the sun shines” comes to mind. 2nd home allowance, subsidised bar and restaurant, staffing allowances for their family members.

Urmstongran

Plus turkeys (MPs) are not going to vote for Christmas. The Tory MPs know their days in Westminster are numbered. They are likely to cling on for as long as possible. They enjoy all the trappings. Why give it up sooner when it might as well be after the summer? “Make hay while the sun shines” comes to mind. 2nd home allowance, subsidised bar and restaurant, staffing allowances for their family members.

Those long summer holidays - paid of course.

Even the Mogg on Newsnight said it would not be sensible to have another PM.

Grantanow

Even the Mogg on Newsnight said it would not be sensible to have another PM.

But he lies, so you can’t really rely on his statement.

Yes we would do so much better without anyone holding the post of prime minister?

I don’t believe there will be a change before the GE mostly because there isn’t an obvious candidate, Braverman makes Thatcher look like a moderate and wants the job but would be Starmers dream, a Labour landslide. Cameron has been mentioned, he’s obviously happy as a safe pair of hands as FS surely not PM again

We can have a new primem minister every day, regardless of which party is in power

The British constitution is not presidential. We elect individual MPs, who group together to form a government and select one of the group to lead it. Nothing to do with the elctorate, and no reason why it should be. Leaders, whether Prime Ministers or Leaders of the Opposition etc have very little real power, they are just a mouthpiece for the party grouping behind them.

I sometimes think the Uk would be better off with a President and a Prime Minister - does it work well in France? I understand that the President has overall power and deals with foreign policy and the Prime Minister handles home affairs.

I think any British pm must be very stretched …..

I understand that the President has overall power and deals with foreign policy and the Prime Minister handles home affairs.
Tat is why the 'great offices of state' are held to be the Home Secretary and the Foreign Secretary (and the Chancellor). The Prime Minister is leader but is supposed to be the 'First among Equals', not the sole holder of power in the Executive.

As for PMs merely being a 'mouth piece' of their party, MOnica, I don't think Thatcher would have taken too kindly to that idea

ronib that is what we have a foreign secretary for. No, the French system does not work particulalry well.

The president appoints the prime Minister, although his appointment has to be approved by their parliament, the prime Minister is even less accountable than in the British system because while their parliament has to approve the pm, they are limited in approving someone nominated by the president.

Monica so would you know if public announcements are usually made by the Minister of State for a department or by the President or Prime Minister? In other words, who is most front facing?

I think Sunak is not very at ease when talking to the cameras?

ronib

Monica so would you know if public announcements are usually made by the Minister of State for a department or by the President or Prime Minister? In other words, who is most front facing?

I think Sunak is not very at ease when talking to the cameras?

Most announcements are made by the porte-parole, a minister in the government who has this rôle. It used to be Gabriel Attal who is now Prime Minister and then Olivier Véran, a neurologist who was Health Minister during Covid, there is a new one now, but I haven't seen her yet. President Macron frequently addresses the nation, which (in my opinion) he does very well.

MOnica, in my opinion it does work, because the elected President does a lot of the things that the PM would do in the UK, so the balance of power is different.

ronib

I sometimes think the Uk would be better off with a President and a Prime Minister - does it work well in France? I understand that the President has overall power and deals with foreign policy and the Prime Minister handles home affairs.

I think any British pm must be very stretched …..

Not as simple as that ronib.
What the Constitution says
The text is very clear on the division of powers. The government "determines and conducts the policy of the nation." Parliament votes on laws and can overturn the government. The president, on the other hand, is an "arbiter" who ensures the "regular functioning of public powers" and "the continuity of the State." They are a guarantor of "national independence, territorial integrity and respect for treaties." They are also the head of the armed forces and the only one who can authorize a nuclear strike.
So the President is involved in both home and foreign affairs and can take control in the case of of threats to the nation, but the government decides domestic policy.

ronib

I sometimes think the Uk would be better off with a President and a Prime Minister - does it work well in France? I understand that the President has overall power and deals with foreign policy and the Prime Minister handles home affairs.

I think any British pm must be very stretched …..

Except that the French usually dislike their president soon after being appointed.

In the UK the PM has all the political power with the agreement of parliament, other countries the president may have a ceremonial head of state, a partly or fully political function.
The French enthusiastically elect a president, probably as the least worse option, then protest at all his policies. In the UK we don’t protest in the same way but disapprove politely, most of us.

Katie59 not forgetting that the UK electorate doesn’t get to vote for a prime minister.

I have no idea what’s going on as I’m in New Zealand as I’ve said before, but I’ll just put my four penneth worth in.
I don’t like Sunak and feel he is ineffective as PM. I think he wanted the role to improve his global image.

Dinahmo

ronib

I sometimes think the Uk would be better off with a President and a Prime Minister - does it work well in France? I understand that the President has overall power and deals with foreign policy and the Prime Minister handles home affairs.

I think any British pm must be very stretched …..

Except that the French usually dislike their president soon after being appointed.

I think the phrase "performative miserabalism" sums it up perfectly. 😂
As one of my U3A students said before the last election, "we elected him, then moaned about him constantly, then we will re-elect him, because he is much better than anyone else."

The point is that in France, there is system where a President stands for election, wins the vote and “he is much better than anyone else”. Although arguably, it doesn’t work out like that in the USA. However, in the UK , the electorate does not have the opportunity to vote for a leader of the country in such a direct way. So French voters are more invested and connected to their own political hierarchy than in the UK?

ronib

Katie59 not forgetting that the UK electorate doesn’t get to vote for a prime minister.

I and lots of others will vote for a party leader next GE my vote goes for Starmer, I’m not really interested who is the local candidate is, once elected they all have to follow the party line.
You hope they do something useful for the locality but no guarantees.

Unfortunately the election is a way off yet, and by no means certain that we won’t be landed with yet another failing Tory government.