Atlantic Ocean circulation nearing ‘devastating’ tipping point

If we achieved net zero tomorrow, it wouldn't make the slightest difference to the world figures.

We produce something like >1% of all emissions, in the world. China has thousands of coal fired powerstations and more are being built

The Guardian, the BBC and many other Establishment sources are more than capable of scaremongering, I believe, for there are vested interests everywhere and 'Green' tech makes money, we are easier to control when scared and in any case the rich never have to give up anything. I am not suggesting there is nothing 'going on' with the climate, and pollution is an obvious - and very horrible - problem. However, the idea of 'reputable' science is questionable, as there are many instances in history when the 'reputable' received wisdom stood firmly in the way of progress for many years. Proper science asks questions, and keeps on asking. It does not shut down dissent with a pejorative label such as 'Climate Change Denier' and deprive those who question the prevalent narrative of their reputations and their livelihood. 'Anti-Vax Nut-job' is another of those labels, which neatly disposes of opposition and shuts down debate. Many doctors and climate scientists have knowingly risked their profession by challenging these dogmas. Why would they do this if they did not have alternative evidence? The wretched term 'disinformation' has become an excuse for the suppression of free speech and open enquiry.

Well even scientists and other very clever folk can’t agree on this topic. There’s little I can do about it anyway so I’m not going to worry about it.

The scientists who did the research (good or bad) don't get any money from the media - that goes to the journalists with no knowledge of how to differentiate a good professional study from a load of student bosh cobbled together as a project in the last few days before the end of term, using their pals as the source of the data and their imagination as the analysis.

Katie59

Elegran

They get research grants to research Katie, not to prove their pre-judged conclusions. Also they publish their methods and all the data they based their conclusions on, so any errors in analysis can be discovered by others in peer-reviewed journals.

It’s all very well publishing’s their conclusions in research papers but their dramatized conclusions are being published for money in newspapers and headlined as proven fact when it is just their predictions.

We don't all read scientific docs but we do read papers!

JenniferEccles

These doom and gloom stories have been doing the rounds for several decades to my knowledge and probably longer.

I for one am extremely relieved that Rishi has signed further contracts for North sea oil and gas drilling.
He is trying to keep us as self sufficient as possible for as long as possible.

Of course if Starmer does get in all that will change.

The report quouted was relatively new.

Also news today about a group of polar bears that are being studied - can't find enough food becuase of the melting ice. They eat seals and there isnot enough ice for htem to hunt from.

With all the warring going on and Amoc it is enough to make you want to never look at the news again . We have to stay as calm as possible as getting scared stiff won’t help us mentally and avoiding the news completely means we are ignorant of what’s going on . From what I read if the Gulf Stream stopped completely it would reduce our temperature by about 10-13 deg so maybe not as bad as it could be altho bad enough -brr I like to be warm . Just imagine places like Siberia tho ? Try to keep cheerful I suppose and it must be an in the background worry for younger generations.

So it is the fault of the media who splash a sensational version of the conclusions, without checking their logic, not of the reputable scientists.

Elegran

They get research grants to research Katie, not to prove their pre-judged conclusions. Also they publish their methods and all the data they based their conclusions on, so any errors in analysis can be discovered by others in peer-reviewed journals.

It’s all very well publishing’s their conclusions in research papers but their dramatized conclusions are being published for money in newspapers and headlined as proven fact when it is just their predictions.

The term “scare mongering” or just crying wolf all the time…. can be over the top sometimes.

We’ve all experience the breakdown of normal weather patterns and hideous unnatural events. I am all too aware of how our planet is slowly crumbling. It IS scary… because sooner or later (whether in our lifetime or not) it will soon reach everyone’s backyard.

Call me a tree hugger, I don’t care. But there are things we can all do to keep staving off the inevitable.

Can we still save our turf, city, country, oceans, planet? That is the question. In some ways we have reached the tipping point. Just my opinion.

One phenomenon, several phenomena. There is no such time as either 12 am or 12 pm. It's noon or midnight.

How many of the authors of the above entries decrying our “overuse” of the planet’s resources are giving up their cars, washing machines, vacuum cleaners, fridges, freezers, dishwashers, gas boilers ….? Seriously deciding that from today you will simply stop owning and using them. Well, the buck stops here, so common just be true to your convictions and give them up right now. Without further discussion and hesitation.

Having your house go on fire or your car be hit by a careless driver are not exactly likely events either, but everyone takes out house and car insurance in case, and tries to prevent these disasters from happening.

Are the governments and citizens of all countries doing their best to act so as to prevent the most extreme results of the population explosion of humans and their profligate production of discarded plastic, greenhouse gasses and rubbish of all kinds? Or are they all saying "Some people think it is not going to happen, so we don't need to consider it and take suitable action." ?

They get research grants to research Katie, not to prove their pre-judged conclusions. Also they publish their methods and all the data they based their conclusions on, so any errors in analysis can be discovered by others in peer-reviewed journals.

Scientists get research grants so it’s in their interest to spread doubt and uncertainty, nobody is going to get funding to research that it’s all fine.

I think you have a very odd view of science, Katie59. Very odd, indeed.

Our own Met Office say that any changes in Atlantic Circulation is very unlikely and they have no axe to grind.
I’m happy to go with an unbiased opinion rather than one with a vested interest.

Scientists get research grants so it’s in their interest to spread doubt and uncertainty, nobody is going to get funding to research that it’s all fine.

CO2 emissions are still rising, there is no indication that they will fall in the foreseeable future, possibly not until global population reduces sometime next century.

These doom and gloom stories have been doing the rounds for several decades to my knowledge and probably longer.

I for one am extremely relieved that Rishi has signed further contracts for North sea oil and gas drilling.
He is trying to keep us as self sufficient as possible for as long as possible.

Of course if Starmer does get in all that will change.

Also, views from a number of scientists

www.sciencemediacentre.org/expert-reaction-to-modelling-study-suggesting-atlantic-ocean-circulation-amoc-could-be-on-course-to-collapse/

Consensus seems to be that there is uncertainty, but that we shouldn't be sitting back waiting for it to happen...

orly

Ah....the Guardian!

And a lot more.

duckduckgo.com/?q=Atlantic+Ocean+circulation+tipping+point&t=chromentp&ia=web

Ah....the Guardian!

And good old rishi Sunak is signing off on hundreds of gas and oil drilling permits for the North Sea. Wonder if the Tories and their supporters have a bolthole to go to when everything goes to s...? Sorry about the rant - just cannot believe what this evil government has done to us!

Dinahmo re cataract op. I found some non prescription spectacles in local pharmacy to tide me over until checkup and new prescription in 6 weeks. Also magnifying glasses help.

What’s up with that today explains the thinking behind the tipping argument. In essence we would need to wait about another 2000 years or so to tip plus 7 x more water is needed to tip than is currently on the planet. Chill.

I’m just glad I’m at this end of my life and not a young person.

It seems to me that we human beings have created more pollution during the last 150 years that at any time previously. We are seeing evidenee of climate change all around us. Ice caps melting, glaciers disappearing, severe coastal erosion along the coast in Suffolk and Norfolk, lakes appearing in parts of Amerrica which have been dry for may years extreme flooding in the Southern USA etc etc. And yet some people prefer to ignore this evidence.

Apologies for any typos - recovering from a cataract op and can't quite see clearluy close up.

Africa could easily feed itself, even with its higher population but tribalism, wars and corruption continue to make cooperation between states impossible.