Changed my mind about voting for Reform uk

M0nica

nanna8 Reform is a far right party. Labour will be one of its biggest supporters, the more people vote for Reform the more seats they win.

Thanks M0nica. I heard that man Garage, Farage talking about it on Utube. As always, some of it sounds ok but most of it - nah. Appealing to patriotism in the old fashioned way. As did a well known German in the 1930s. Garage seems to have a friendship with Trump, how surprising 🤮

nanna8

M0nica

nanna8 Reform is a far right party. Labour will be one of its biggest supporters, the more people vote for Reform the more seats they win.

Thanks M0nica. I heard that man Garage, Farage talking about it on Utube. As always, some of it sounds ok but most of it - nah. Appealing to patriotism in the old fashioned way. As did a well known German in the 1930s. Garage seems to have a friendship with Trump, how surprising 🤮

When Trump won in 2016 Farage was one of the first to rush across the atlantic to be photographed with him...

(Mind you, Michael Gove wasn't far behind him...)

ronib

I thought Reform had lost credibility when Anderson was announced as the first Reform Mp. Obviously not voted in on the Reform manifesto but why let petty details stand in the way?

Yes, indeed. I was reading about the attempts via private member’s bills to force a recall and a by-election when someone changes parties mid-government.

The last was introduced as a Ten Minute Bill by Anthony Mangnall (Con Totnes) in 2020. He proposed that anyone changing parties be subject to the recall process and by-election if 10% of eligible electors have signed that petition.

You can read it here.

www.parallelparliament.co.uk/debate/2020-09-02/commons/commons-chamber/recall-of-mps-change-of-party-affiliation

Key text:

Owing to the Representation of the People Act 1969, our electorates are greeted in every voting booth across the country with our names, our party names and our party logos. In short, we benefit significantly from the role that the party plays in each and every one of our elections.

Parties are therefore often more visible than the candidate, from their leaders to their Cabinets and their manifestos. They act as a magnet to either attract or repel voters to or from to their cause. So when a candidate who has campaigned using those logos, promoting that manifesto and supporting that leader, switches sides, they are doing so against everything they told the thousands of voters they connected with during the election. This is not promoting democracy; it is degrading it.

Like most private member’s bills, althought it passed its first reading and was scheduled for a second, it then stalled. Most Ten Minute Bills do as they are given very low priority in the Parliamentary process and Goverment usually opposes them on second reading.

If you click on the Ayes in favour of the bill you will see Lee Anderson’s name there.

The bill may not have got very far but there’s a principle here. Anderson effectively agreed that he should be subject to the recall process. He should serve as an Independent until the next election.

Also, people might like to read this January 2024 Russell Jackson article from Byline Times about the people and money behind Reform:

Reform UK Limited: The Political Business Brought to You by Billionaires

bylinetimes.com/2024/01/18/reform-uk-limited-the-political-business-brought-to-you-by-billionaires/

Summing up:

Empty Threats?

Tice, like Farage before him, has repeatedly pledged to field Reform candidates in every constituency at the next general election.

But given Reform’s current financial position, this seems like another empty threat designed to drag the Tories even further right and to encourage the Tories to adopt policies which the Tory Right, Reform’s donors, GB News’s funders, and the billionaire owners of the Mail, Sun, Telegraph, Metro, Times and Spectator would all welcome.

Following Brexit on 31st January 2020, Farage opportunistically reoriented Reform by opposing lockdowns and Net Zero, paralleling global right-wing populist anti-lockdown and anti-climate science sentiments.

Reform company documents reveal a unique structure for a UK political Party which gives almost total control to its leader, Tice. The structure has been criticised for not providing the party’s more than 115,000 paying registered supporters with any voting power to influence policy. Perhaps the party’s funders and shareholders have more say.

I think the Byline Times article is a little bit out of date. I have read recently (but can't remember where) that Tice has said that Reform will be fielding a candidate in all constituencies.

Though it's a mystery as to how they could possibly afford to do this...

Agreed.

^Despite receiving more than £10 million pounds in donations over the past four years, Reform Treasurer and Secretary, Mehrtash A’Zami, stated at the end of 2022 that Reform had net liabilities of more than £1 million, “a significant percentage of which comes from Director’s loans”.

Those loans were from Tice.

Fifteen months is a long time in politics and none of the backers are strapped for cash.

In the taped conversation of Anderson speaking at Cambridge Rugby Club last November, when he was lambasting Reform, he was of the opinion that Reform want Labour to win the next GE, to bring in PR so that Reform (should it survive) can have more influence in the future.

As M0nica said, they are more damaging to the Tory vote than Labour. I see Reform as a disruptor rather than any serious contender for power.

You lost me "I was consdering voting for the Reform Party."

Goodness! Is that the only reason???

Urmstongran

Well they’re never going to form a government so I’m going to vote Reform. I can’t vote for the Tories and Labour’s front bench and Shadow Ministers don’t inspire confidence. Dawn Butler, Lammy, Jonathan Ashworth, Angela Rayner. No!

But Richard Tice and Lee Anderson DO inspire confidence? Reform is a private limited company, owned by Tice and Farage, not a real political party. I'm not sure how that could inspire confidence.

If they can afford to field so many candidates, you have to ask, who is actually behind them, funding them, and pulling the strings?

I wouldn’t dream of voting for that fascist party.

Good job! Though I would hope that isn’t the only reason you’re not voting for them!

Reform is a clever name, but really it is a party of the far right. Their policies might bring about a certain amount of private wealth, but there would be public squalor as they cut the services on which we rely.
Do not be deceived by their glib talk.

Ghandi made the proclamation quoted, presumably aware of the way animals were and are treated in his country? And of the dreadful caste system that even today condemns so many human beings to an awful existence? Ghandi was not the saint we are encouraged to think he was. History will mostly. show our idols to have feet of clay.

In the past have always voted Tory but wouldn't do so this time. Can't bring myself to vote for labour either at the moment. Neither side has a real 'leader' and neither side seem to have more than a handful ( if that) of experienced individuals who have the country as their prime interest. Do not agree with the Reform party ideas and would not vote Green after the mess they have made of my local area and quite frankly know very little about the Lib Dems. Doesn't leave me with much does it?

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I think that if you read any Party’s manifesto you will be dismayed. Historically, what they say and what they do are always two very different things.

Time for a change. And on the basis of ‘they couldn’t be/do any worse’, I could have been tempted to tick Redorm, but I’ve seen no signs of a candidate in my Ward.

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Oops! Sorry. Unnoticed typo. Reform.

(But you knew that!!)

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Maremia

If they can afford to field so many candidates, you have to ask, who is actually behind them, funding them, and pulling the strings?

Arron Banks, don’t know if he’s pulling the strings (not clever enough) but he’s the one with the money.

Legal trail hunting following a scent laid previously with a designated route is not chasing an animal, its like drag hunting, and digging setts, dens, terriers are not allowed

Reform Party are the only party with any common sense. They are NOT far right! That's what the others want you to believe.

Germanshepherdsmum

More than one intelligent poster has said they will vote for Reform. Have they read and considered what passes as their ‘manifesto’ or are they swayed by the rhetoric?

I too read the Reform PLC Manifesto, GSM, but I am not sure that the supporters on here (and anywhere else) have read it properly. Brushing aside my irritation with the sloppy grammar and punctuation, it is 'dog whistle' politics at its worst, all ready to appeal to those who expect a quick fix for their perceived grievances (immigration, NHS waiting lists etc) without detailing just how it will be paid for, let alone enforced. Zero NHS waiting lists? Really? This is like the Brexit manifesto, all unicorns and sunlit uplands, is aimed at the same people, the same people who will be seriously let down. As for Tice, being 'charming'......he makes my flesh crawl.

JudyBloom

Reform Party are the only party with any common sense. They are NOT far right! That's what the others want you to believe.

Yeah, ok, so what are they then? Middle of the road? Lefties? Have you actually read their manifesto?

The reason they don’t say how they will achieve these miracles is that they have absolutely no idea. It’s nothing but a load of very badly written rubbish.

JudyBloom

Reform Party are the only party with any common sense. They are NOT far right! That's what the others want you to believe.

And so I ask again, just as I did on the Lee Anderson discussion - where no Reform supporter picked up the gauntlet, please explain the policies and how they will be funded.

Never forget that this is the Brexit party under a new name. Neither they or anybody else knew how to implement that either.

manifestos can easily be ignored, like the Tories for the last election they didn't say they are privatising the NHS but thats exactly what they've done to the dental system. I want the NHS to be fit, healthy & well funded even if I pay more tax so I'm voting Labour they set up the NHS in the face of Tory opposition so they get my vote now