Dr. Hilary Cass - report re trans.

It sounds like a very pragmatic approach has been taken and I agree, there will be a backlash against the Dr.

It's so beneficial when someone with actual experience contributes to these discussions so thank you Luckygirl .

Yes. unfortunately she's going to get some flack Jane which for me will increase the reports credibility.

From what I have seen so far (obviously I haven't read the whole report yet) it looks very promising.

I'm pleased that the results have come through ahead of the serious electioneering, as it means that both parties can take it on board when forming policies.

It will be interesting to see how those who have been so vocal about their position will react. I haven't seen any comment from politicians yet, but there will have to be some serious eating of words, and I hope they have the humility to admit that they were wrong. I wouldn't blame those who have suffered as a result of the culture wars for gloating a bit, but I also hope that there will be temporary 'YES" and then a more reasonable conversation which allows the climbdown to happen with dignity.

It’s good your grandchild has a loving supportive family. Also that the Cass Report is here to guide their nhs support

It will be interesting to see how it impacts on election statements

Doodledog

I wasn’t engaging with the comments about dyslexia etc, as I suspect they were goading.

My comment was about the phrasing of the term ‘in the wrong body’. A bit like ‘authentic self’ it is a buzzword that children hear from adults - if that were not the case they would all express the concept differently.

I wasn’t engaging with the comments about dyslexia etc, as I suspect they were goading.
Yes, they were, perhaps I shouldn't have bothered either. It was goading, particularly from someone who, from what we have been told, must have known better. I was just astonished.

Luckygirl your DGC is lucky to have the loving support of the family and I hope this new report will ensure that the NHS will instigate new and sympathetic protocols to help young people - children! - who are trying to work out their feelings at such a sensitive age.

Callistemon21

Glorianny

Doodledog

The phrase has sprung up over the past few years. It has to come from adults. I never heard a single child say they were ‘in the wrong body’ when I was growing up, and none of my children’s friends said it either. It has had to come from somewhere.

I don't suppose you knew children who were autistic, dyslexic or dyspraxic either. Times change.

Of course we knew children who were autistic, dyslexic at least 60 years ago!

Child Guidance Clinics? Schools which had specialist teachers for children with dyslexia?

I think, despite the fact that we know more now, there was more help available then than now.

As for dyspraxia, no, I don't think that was so recognised until recently.

Sorry Callistemon21 you are so wrong. Even 30 years ago I had to fight for a dyslexia diagnosis for my obviously very bright but virtually illiterate son. Still one of his English teachers wrote on his report "X is very bright but unfortunately this is not evidenced in his written work."

When Doodledog was at school dyslexia was not generally recognised although the theory had been in existence since the 1880s.

In 1978 the Warnock Report on special educational needs was published by the then Department for Education and Science. Here, the government’s antipathy to the term was proactive. The report’s author, Baroness Mary Warnock, recalls being summoned by a senior civil servant of the Department, who told her that she ‘should not suggest that there is a special category of learning difficulty called dyslexia'

Come to think of it its much like the trans issue isn't it? Some think it's real ,some think it's not, some don't want to mention it.

Sorry Callistemon21 you are so wrong

Sorry, Glorianny, if you had that experience in your area.

However, I am not wrong.

Callistemon21

^Sorry Callistemon21 you are so wrong^

Sorry, Glorianny, if you had that experience in your area.

However, I am not wrong.

Oh but you are. The term "dyslexia" was not used or accepted in schools in the 1960s and 70s. We were told to use the term "specific reading difficulties". As anyone with any experience of dyslexia knows the difficulties are much more complex. The perception of many in education and government was that this was a term used by middle class parents to excuse their thick kids.If you have evidence to the contrary please post it. I have no doubt that there were clinics and people dealing with the problem in certain places, but any idea that the condition was recognised or dealt with in mainstream education is completely wrong. It was denied and ignored.

One of our sons was diagnosed mid 80’s with dyslexia.

Glorianny I imagine it differed from area to area then as it does now.

Glorianny

Callistemon21

Sorry Callistemon21 you are so wrong

Sorry, Glorianny, if you had that experience in your area.

However, I am not wrong.

Oh but you are. The term "dyslexia" was not used or accepted in schools in the 1960s and 70s. We were told to use the term "specific reading difficulties". As anyone with any experience of dyslexia knows the difficulties are much more complex. The perception of many in education and government was that this was a term used by middle class parents to excuse their thick kids.If you have evidence to the contrary please post it. I have no doubt that there were clinics and people dealing with the problem in certain places, but any idea that the condition was recognised or dealt with in mainstream education is completely wrong. It was denied and ignored.

A term used by middle class parents to excuse their thick kids

Wow, just wow…

I totally agree with you.

I could not care less what people do with their own bodies as long as the NHS isn't paying for it. Some of these people who want to change sex need to think carefully about it because I have yet to see a male that has changed into a female look like a female and vice versa.

GrannyGravy13

One of our sons was diagnosed mid 80’s with dyslexia.

Glorianny I imagine it differed from area to area then as it does now.

The 80's was when it was first accepted in schools. Even then many children were not being tested and many teachers had zero knowledge of the condition. I thought at the time that it was simply a matter of working harder to teach the child. It took me a long time to realise the severity of the condition in some people. Callistemon21 thinks schools accepted it 60 years ago. They didn't.

I really wasn't going to get involved in this diversion, but my original comment was that 'being in the wrong body' didn't exist as a concept when I was at school or when my children were. My daughter is dyslexic, so I am very well aware that it was known about then (she is 30 now). In fact it was so well known that there was a central service for dyslexic students at my workplace before she was born.

However. This is not the point, which was that the phrasing of 'in the wrong body' is clearly from the same playbook as 'authentic selves', 'what's in their pants', and so on, or it would be expressed in different ways by different children. As I reiterated that more than once, I would have thought it was clear, and that there is no link with the knowledge or otherwise of conditions such as dyslexia in the past, which is just a diversion.

GrannyGravy13

One of our sons was diagnosed mid 80’s with dyslexia.

Glorianny I imagine it differed from area to area then as it does now.

I worked with a teacher who specialised in children with dyslexia.
That was not in a school and it was in the 1960s.

However, it's not worth discussing with Glorianny as her own truth is always absolute.
🙂

GrannyGravy13

Glorianny

Callistemon21

Sorry Callistemon21 you are so wrong

Sorry, Glorianny, if you had that experience in your area.

However, I am not wrong.

Oh but you are. The term "dyslexia" was not used or accepted in schools in the 1960s and 70s. We were told to use the term "specific reading difficulties". As anyone with any experience of dyslexia knows the difficulties are much more complex. The perception of many in education and government was that this was a term used by middle class parents to excuse their thick kids.If you have evidence to the contrary please post it. I have no doubt that there were clinics and people dealing with the problem in certain places, but any idea that the condition was recognised or dealt with in mainstream education is completely wrong. It was denied and ignored.

A term used by middle class parents to excuse their thick kids

Wow, just wow…

I know. But it was a view many in education took. And it was something that was widely said at the time. Seems awful now.

Callistemon21 thinks schools accepted it 60 years ago. They didn't.
Presumably not in your area.

Do stop or I will report you.

Callistemon21

GrannyGravy13

One of our sons was diagnosed mid 80’s with dyslexia.

Glorianny I imagine it differed from area to area then as it does now.

I worked with a teacher who specialised in children with dyslexia.
That was not in a school and it was in the 1960s.

However, it's not worth discussing with Glorianny as her own truth is always absolute.
🙂

As I said there was some provision out side mainstream ed. But that doesn't mean it was recognised or dealt with. It meant if you could afford to pay your child would get the help they needed.

I wonder how many parents of trans children with money will take their children out of the UK for help?

Callistemon21

^Callistemon21 thinks schools accepted it 60 years ago. They didn't.^
Presumably not in your area.

Do stop or I will report you.

Report me.
I've posted a quote about the Warnock report on Special Education where she was told not to use the term. I can post links and quotes about the use of the term "specific reading difficulties" which I was instructed to use when I qualified.
I can post links to articles that deny dyslexia.
You knew one person who worked outside mainstream education and dealt with dyslexia. That doesn't mean children in mainstream education were diagnosed or helped. They were not.

I absolutely agree, Doodledog about dyslexia and the recognition thereof, but the term has been used to cover so many discrepancies and diversions in the understanding of the teaching of reading. ADHD and Autism are going the same way, hence the huge waiting lists for a diagnosis, which will then, they believe, solve everything.
I am concerned about professional people who have been driven from their posts by sticking to the facts in the trans-person debate, and those who have paid lip-service to the ideology for fear of retribution. It is very obvious from the comments and interviews I have seen in the past few hours that the trans lobby will refuse to accept the evidence and continue to put up a vicious fight.

.^ It meant if you could afford to pay your child would get the help they needed.^

Nope. It was not private.

Because you had a poor experience doesn't mean it happened everywhere.

Apologies for adding to the thread derailment but:
As a SENCO in a state school I was supporting children with dyslexia in the late seventies and in our LA we were working with a specialist Educational Psychologis, the Dyslexia Association and peripatetic teachers. I then became an adviser and worked with a Paediatrician with specialist knowledge of dyspraxia in the late 8Os, as the condition was increasingly recognised in our schools. Having had the opportunity to work on a wide regional basis I know from experience, that while provision in LAs varied, there was also a great deal of knowledge and support available.
To return to the topic, I am pleased to see that such a compassionate, informed and pragmatic report is now available to those working in this difficult area.

I agree, easybee. I know that dyslexia and ADD are often linked, and am pleased that as knowledge advances more things can be taken into account, and children treated accordingly. However, that is not relevant to my comment, which was about the phraseology so often used by young children, specifically 'in the wrong body', which I think has to be being parroted, as otherwise they would all use different expressions.

I apologise for repeating this over and over, but I am so fed up with the tactic of picking up on a small point and using it to divert the conversation away from questions which are difficult or awkward. How many posts have there been about dyslexia on this thread, which is about the Cass report?

I hope if any parents do take their children out of the UK for help, they do plenty of research. That said I hope that they digest this report in full and are led by the common sense information provided.