Scottish political mess. Is Devolution working?

They should be proud of their English heritage, there’s much to be proud about.Nobody should allow others to say otherwise.
Just as Northern Irish, Scottish and Welsh are proud of their own heritages.

Agree Casdon

Katie59

I don’t really care if devolution is working or not give them independence and let them stew in their own chaos.

Is this the English heritage you want to be proud of?

Casdon

I’ll no doubt be shot down for saying this, but I don’t think English people really understand what it feels like to be Scottish, Welsh or Northern Irish in the structure of the UK. Having your concerns and issues dismissed, without any understanding of your separateness is not the way to encourage union.

Their issues are no different than Cornwall or Yorkshire or Rural areas devolution hasn’t been a great success and change have mostly been just for the sake of being different.

'Understanding of 'separateness'? I would have thought 'differences' would be a better choice of word.

I rest my case.

Much as I hate to disagree with Elegran it's clear that the current Scottish government is not managing public life very well at all.
However, all I want is for all the countries of the UK to work together for the benefit of us all. The striving for difference up here has led to the development of deep and unpleasant political divisions instead of the government focussing on delivering the public services that we need.

Katie59

The English identify as such to distinguish ourselves from the Scots who choose to see themselves as different they would say it about national heritage, so why should English not be proud of their heritage

Why not indeed? However, that doesn't mean that it is anyone else's inheritance.

Perhaps Cornwall, Yorkshire et all would do better if they had more control of at least some parts of their destiny?

Aveline

Much as I hate to disagree with Elegran it's clear that the current Scottish government is not managing public life very well at all.
However, all I want is for all the countries of the UK to work together for the benefit of us all. The striving for difference up here has led to the development of deep and unpleasant political divisions instead of the government focussing on delivering the public services that we need.

That isn't disagreeing with me at all, Aveline. Co-operation and working together for the benefit of all would be a great plan for all our politicians to follow. I just don't see that as necessarily being inimical to having control to manage matters which don't concern any other parts of the UK. Horses for courses.

I don't think that that the current Scottish government is not managing public life very well at all, either, but that is not the same as claiming that no-one in Scotland should be trusted with running Scottish public life.

Ignore the double negative in the last paragraph - an extra "not" crept in while I was typing.

Elegran

Perhaps Cornwall, Yorkshire et all would do better if they had more control of at least some parts of their destiny?

They have a government and are part of England. How divisive would you like to get?

tickingbird

Elegran

Perhaps Cornwall, Yorkshire et all would do better if they had more control of at least some parts of their destiny?

They have a government and are part of England. How divisive would you like to get?

England doesn't have a devolved government, though.

England does have regions, but Cornwall is part of the South-West region, Yorkshire is Yorkshire and Humber.
The present regional boundaries were the ones which were the constituency boundaries for the EU Parliament.

HousePlantQueen

OldFrill

Katie59

I don’t really care if devolution is working or not give them independence and let them stew in their own chaos.

Why should you force independence on a country where the majority don't want it.

and ironically, the majority of Scots had Brexit foisted upon them.

It was a United Kingdom vote. Not a separate vote for all countries of the UK. Of GB and NI.

I have always hoped that Scottish independence wouldn’t happen and I haven’t changed my mind.
I do hope the next leader ( if there is one) will abandon the independence obsession and concentrate on other matters which are of concern to the Scots.

Speaking of Scotland, where is Volver.? I haven’t seen any posts from her for ages, over a year possibly.
Of course people can and do change their username.

“It was a United Kingdom vote. Not a separate vote for all countries of the UK. Of GB and NI.”

Scotland is not a separate nation (yet) their problem is nationalists, the SNP had a majority until recently, independence should be separated from other issues

Camilla Tominey is no one to comment on what should happen in another country.

tickingbird

Elegran

Perhaps Cornwall, Yorkshire et all would do better if they had more control of at least some parts of their destiny?

They have a government and are part of England. How divisive would you like to get?

I only said "perhaps" - that isn't divisive, unlike posting, as Katie59 did "I don’t really care if devolution is working or not give them independence and let them stew in their own chaos." Perhaps that might even qualify as hate speech or racism.

However, I wasn't talking the division of independence, just the devolution of sme powers (exactly which powers would depend on the negotiation) and they wouldn't be divided off from the rest of the country. They would still have representatives attending at Westminster, as does Scotland.

If Cornwall or Yorkshire feel strongly enough, it is up to them to press for whatever system they want., but using the legitimate powers they have negotiated to vote in a party that doesn't please people who don't even live in Scotland is not grounds for evict all Scots from the UK.

If the SNP are useless, Scots are clear-eyed enough to vote them out next time round, and if they don't do so, the SNP must be doing what the majority of the electors want.

“I only said "perhaps" - that isn't divisive, unlike posting, as Katie59 did "I don’t really care if devolution is working or not give them independence and let them stew in their own chaos." Perhaps that might even qualify as hate speech or racism.”

I don’t like devolution it is divisive and encourages dissent either stay in the UK, or leave and do your own thing, it’s like having a partner who is always complaining they are being done down, OK go you own way

keepingquiet

Camilla Tominey is no one to comment on what should happen in another country.

An opinion can be based on any topic under the sun, surely?
😁

Yes Volver kept things feisty! (I always thought ‘revolver’! 😁).

She didn’t suffer fools gladly. I think I must be one as I caught the sharp edge of her tongue on many occasions!

Engand doesn't NEED devolved government WESTMINSTER is an English parliament ,work it out for yourself,add up the MP's from Ireland Scotland and wales and ENGLISH MP's can outvote us all every time and regularly have.For centuries.
The recent debacle over the Gaza situation is just one of many...maybe worse as it was Labour pressurising the speaker to get his own bill brought forward and SNP's dropped but its nothing new.
It saddens me that intelligent women like Aveline cant see what happens ...or doesn't care .I and everyone I know is happy to pay an extra penny or two in tax because what we gain is immense AND its spent here where its needed .After decaades of Labour cowtowing to WM its great to see that we can do things a different way
JUST because its not YOUR way KATIE DOESN'T MAKE IT WRONG.
Independence will never be off the agenda as long as SNP exist..after all its the core policy they were founded on.
Good luck with your own mess,with full control of our resources and assets Scotland will flourish...even with the naysayers on here and in unionist enclaves in Scotland.

There are times when you do yourself and your stance no favours paddyann54. There is never any need to shout.
Also, why should the regions of England not aspire to devolved powers, if that happened the function of the Westminster government would be much more clearly defined? Just because you want independence for Scotland should not mean you take a negative view of devolution in England.

I ignore people who shout in real life, I certainly do not pay attention to anyone who posts in a shouty style.

It's kow-tow, btw, unless that was meant to be deliberately rude.

From the Chinese k’o-t’ou.