Nothing Behind The Eyes

Cossy

When I attribute some of the blame to the govt I’m talking about cuts in services for vulnerable families and care leavers, such as sure start, family workers, youth clubs and youth services. Some parents need this support to help them to become better, more stable people able to be better role models. I worked with families like these, before our project t lost its funding, and it was a massive eye opener working with vulnerable families in their own homes.

One of my family was part of a proactive police initiative working mainly with young people in a notorious and very deprived local estate. It took a lot of time and hard work for them to be accepted and trusted in the community, but it was paying off as locals would come to them with problems, trouble was anticipated before it happened and crime rates started to drop. The team was disbanded as soon as the swingeing cuts to police numbers were made and they were diverted to reactive work in the city centre. An opportunity missed to make a real difference.

I have checked and as usual information on stats relating to sex of assailant is utterly useless, but what it looks like is there has been a considerable increase in girls but they remain a small number.

Cossy

Incidentally it’s not just boys who carry and use knives. Girls are just as likely to these days

I must have missed all the reports of knife attacks by girls!! As I said, part of the problem. Refusing to see and acknowledge because of your own bias doesn’t help. We need solutions and grass roots change.

That would go against all other statistics on violent crimes if that is true about girls using knives as much as boys.

Good post, tickingbird.

Cossy

When I attribute some of the blame to the govt I’m talking about cuts in services for vulnerable families and care leavers, such as sure start, family workers, youth clubs and youth services. Some parents need this support to help them to become better, more stable people able to be better role models. I worked with families like these, before our project t lost its funding, and it was a massive eye opener working with vulnerable families in their own homes.

Hi Cossy, I worked in family support too and now work in education. Family support is so important and sometimes it’s so subtle to implement change within a family. It’s such a shame it isn’t more valued

Incidentally it’s not just boys who carry and use knives. Girls are just as likely to these days.

tickingbird

Blaming single mums???

Stop twisting everything to suit your narrative. Single mums weren’t mentioned and it’s a fact that boys brought up without a responsible father figure are more likely to go off the rails. It doesn’t mean all of them.

As for feckless parents they do exist. Parents who don’t give a hoot where their kids are when they aren’t home at night or who they’re with and what they’re doing.

Burying your heads in the sand and pretending these factors don’t come into the equation is naive and blinkered.

If you can’t or don’t want to acknowledge that you’re part of the problem.

Sorry what did you mean by the term “fatherless” children then? It sounded just like a dig at single mothers!

I simply asked you what you meant by “feckless” parents? I didn’t absolve parents of responsibility for their children, I was merely stating that SOME parents face tremendous difficulties providing safe and stable homes for their children and that they could really do with outside help and support, services which have been cut year on year by this govt.

Then, as you quite rightly point out, there’s the kids whose parents appear to let their them run riot.

Statistically though it’s more likely than children in care or just leaving care or brought up with domestic violence who are most likely to be drawn into gangs and get into serious trouble.

I can assure you I’m not “part of the problem”

It's not as simple as that, though.

It's a fact that households without a father figure are likely to be financially disadvantaged, which in itself is more likely to lead to crime.

There are all sorts of factors to take into account.

Blaming single mums???

Stop twisting everything to suit your narrative. Single mums weren’t mentioned and it’s a fact that boys brought up without a responsible father figure are more likely to go off the rails. It doesn’t mean all of them.

As for feckless parents they do exist. Parents who don’t give a hoot where their kids are when they aren’t home at night or who they’re with and what they’re doing.

Burying your heads in the sand and pretending these factors don’t come into the equation is naive and blinkered.

If you can’t or don’t want to acknowledge that you’re part of the problem.

When I attribute some of the blame to the govt I’m talking about cuts in services for vulnerable families and care leavers, such as sure start, family workers, youth clubs and youth services. Some parents need this support to help them to become better, more stable people able to be better role models. I worked with families like these, before our project t lost its funding, and it was a massive eye opener working with vulnerable families in their own homes.

tickingbird

^There is too much concern for the evil perpetrators and not enough for the victims and their families.^

I totally agree and I don’t like the way certain posters manage to turn everything into the fault of the government.

Fatherless families and feckless parents also contribute greatly to the behaviour of youngsters.

Blaming “single Mums” is far worse than blaming the govt.

I was a single (working) Mum for 9 years, not even once did my well behaved son cause problems.

There are many many good single mums (and dads) bring up decent, well behaved children.

As for “feckless” parents, I’m not sure I even know what this means, but they’re enough documented cases of kids from perfectly stable backgrounds going off the rails.

I agree that it is not the sole fault of the Government. Parents have (or should have) responsibility for their children, and teach them to be good, responsible citizens with self respect and respect for others. The majority of parents do, of course, take this on fully and do it well. Sadly though, quite often (not always), the upbringing of some of these young people facing the justice system has been chaotic and confused with parents who are poor role models, and they find themselves in a life that often leads to them carrying out violent acts or getting caught up with more hardened criminals, and so getting into trouble with the law, and so facing a life that they had not envisaged as a consequence of those actions, ie, a long term of imprisonment and a police record.

I don’t think fatherless families necessarily mean the children being brought up without one are going to turn to a life of violence and crime, though - that’s a rather sweeping assumption to make - many children are brought up well with just a mother and go on to lead normal, happy lives. (Equally, children brought up with just a father).

I hope your grandson is all right, sparklefizz.
I remember when something similar happened to my DS when he was young because he defended a girl (who was not even his girlfriend) and got a black eye for his trouble.
It wasn't so usual to carry knives in those days.

What is wrong nowadays when someone can accidentally bump into someone, perhaps give them a look or defend a friend or even 'look wrong' and then get killed by another youth with no boundaries, no conscience, who is just filled with hate?

I hope you grandson is ok sparklefizz I know how and your family you must be feeling.

When something similar happened to one of our GC it was heartbreaking for us all, mixed with a very large dose of anger.

I’m so sorry to hear that Sparklefizz.

There is too much concern for the evil perpetrators and not enough for the victims and their families.

I totally agree and I don’t like the way certain posters manage to turn everything into the fault of the government.

Fatherless families and feckless parents also contribute greatly to the behaviour of youngsters.

My grandson had his nose broken last week by 3 lads from his school. They had racially abused my grandson’s girlfriend and when he verbally defended her, all 3 attacked him. Thank goodness no knives were involved. This was in a town in Devon, not some inner city area.

It has been awful for us as a family.

Some YOIs were like boarding schools with more facilities than many state schools.

Cunningham went to a 16 year old birthday party in another city (in a nice area of Bath) armed with a knife so he was intending to injure, maim or kill someone.
His intent was to cause evil at a girl's birthday party. There are no excuses, he knew what he was doing.

I think his sentence should be far longer, no matter his age.

"Mikey's mother, Hayley Ryall, cried as her victim impact statement was read out on her behalf in court.

In the statement she said she could not bear to look at photos of her son, knowing she would never see his face again.

She described feeling like she was living in a film, or in a nightmare and said: “The day my Mikey was killed, my life changed forever.

“Christmas used to be magical, but I’ll never celebrate it again.

“New Year was the same; how could I look forward to the year ahead without him?”

Mikey’s father, Michael Roynon, said in his statement: “I feel so tortured at the loss of my boy...I feel like I have a life sentence."

While Mikey's Grandmother Teresa Owen said she would "swap places with Mikey in a heartbeat", if she could."

There is too much concern for the evil perpetrators and not enough for the victims and their families.

it's awful and they are all children

Callistemon21

They showed no remorse and even laughed in court.

It's going to take a mighty effort and resources we don't see to have to rehabilitate youths such as these so that they can become useful members of society by the time they are 30.

Perhaps if funding hadn’t been cut in both probation (half privatised) and Youth Offending, we might not have quite as many incidents as we have.

They showed no remorse and even laughed in court.

It's going to take a mighty effort and resources we don't see to have to rehabilitate youths such as these so that they can become useful members of society by the time they are 30.

M0nica

Callistemon no matter how dreadful this lads crime is. he is only 16. He is still leaglly and mentally a child. This does not reduce the heinousness of his crime, but it may well be that by the time he is in his 30s he may well be a very different person and should be given the opportunity to return to normal life and contribute something to it.

I am very uncomforable with the way so many people seem to be able to, on one side to stop children under 18 from marrying, smoking, undergoing all kinds of relatively trivial experiences because of their youth and immaturity, yet when that same youth and immaturity leads them to do dreadful thngs immediately want to lock them up for life as if they were hardened criminals.

The minds of children of 16 are malleable and can change. There will be exceptions - and we hear of them, but many more young criminals come out of prison and become useful citizens.

I agree but I would also add that we need far more stringent checks on carrying knives, particularly in public areas and schools.

I once worked with a family worker who had been in prison for gun crime, thankfully no one died. Since he’s been out he’s literally dedicated his entire life to educating schools, communities, parents and kids to the danger of gangs, gang mentality and knife and gun crime as well as drugs. He and his lovely wife run a company and work country wide.

He’s used his awful childhood (brought up between women’s refuges, a “runner” at 8, a dealer at 12) and his crimes to the advantage of many and seriously turned his entire life around. I’m proud to have worked alongside him for a short period.

Callistemon no matter how dreadful this lads crime is. he is only 16. He is still leaglly and mentally a child. This does not reduce the heinousness of his crime, but it may well be that by the time he is in his 30s he may well be a very different person and should be given the opportunity to return to normal life and contribute something to it.

I am very uncomforable with the way so many people seem to be able to, on one side to stop children under 18 from marrying, smoking, undergoing all kinds of relatively trivial experiences because of their youth and immaturity, yet when that same youth and immaturity leads them to do dreadful thngs immediately want to lock them up for life as if they were hardened criminals.

The minds of children of 16 are malleable and can change. There will be exceptions - and we hear of them, but many more young criminals come out of prison and become useful citizens.