Labour and the Tories have disenfranchised me

Don’t worry Luckygirl the person I shall probably vote for apparently has no chance of being returned ☹️

I feel much the same as ferry23, none of the parties hold any attraction for me at all. But if not voting or spoiling my ballot paper would be the other options I'm not really happy with that as it is a wasted vote. Somebody once suggested that you could have a box for "none of the above" though I doubt that this choice is much better.
I'd agree that voting for someone who would be a good constituency MP should be the answer, but once they get promoted to some sort of office it appears that their constituency work often goes by the board.
And the constituency changes mean that some MP's higher up in the parties are being parachuted in to replace current candidates so that they can get a seat. An ambitious MP would not be my first choice of candidate as for them their constituency work may come a poor second.

ronib

131 pages Labour’s manifesto! Why is it so long?

The various factions of the Labour party hold differing view on how to achieve the necessary ends and what those ends should be. I'm guessing that this manifesto has to satisfy all those involved.

Whitewavemark2

ronib

Wwm2 have we not heard growing the economy before ? Before the economy collapsed again? Saying something just doesn’t make it happen or so I remind my grandchildren.

Then from your misunderstanding I would refer you to the manifesto.

Two clear tenants outlined by the speakers at the beginning.

Health and Housing

‘I would refer you to the manifesto’ 😂
Keen as I am to see Labour get in this time I don’t think I’ve ever seen such faith from anyone in a manifesto.
Can’t decide if it’s sad or funny.
We all know the promises made by politicians before an election and what actually happens afterwards.

Luckily I have a really good standing Labour MP for my constituency who I could always vote for, but I won’t hold my breath that anything much will change on a national level.
At least tho the incompetent Tory Party will be out and can fight between themselves for the next five years.

ferry23 I get where you’re coming from, and you not voting at all isn’t apathy it’s thought out passion, so you do whatever suits you.Many people feel the same.
Apathy is what the younger people often feel, they can’t be bothered to walk down to the voting station or get organised enough for a postal vote.

ronib

131 pages Labour’s manifesto! Why is it so long?

Having just spent an hour of my life reading it, it's very thorough.

Oreo

ferry23 I get where you’re coming from, and you not voting at all isn’t apathy it’s thought out passion, so you do whatever suits you.Many people feel the same.
Apathy is what the younger people often feel, they can’t be bothered to walk down to the voting station or get organised enough for a postal vote.

How does anybody know the difference between apathy and not agreeing with any candidate?

What kind of government do those who don't want to choose anybody actually want? If nobody voted, we'd have anarchy. If only one person in each constituency voted, we'd have a perfect opportunity for any extremist to take over with the FPTP system.

Labour say they will raise an extra £8.6bn in tax receipts by 2028/9. That’s a long way away, and how many times over have they already spent it in their pledges? You will not be surprised to hear me say that it’s all just so much talk.

MissInterpreted

Not knowing who to vote for is not the same as being disenfranchised. Vote for somebody, anybody - or even spoil your ballot paper, but make the effort to vote. People fought and died to give us that right - a right which is still denied to those in some countries.

👏👏👏👏👏👏

growstuff from what ferry23 has written on here it’s obviously not apathy.Read her posts.

Germanshepherdsmum

Labour say they will raise an extra £8.6bn in tax receipts by 2028/9. That’s a long way away, and how many times over have they already spent it in their pledges? You will not be surprised to hear me say that it’s all just so much talk.

I trust it's a possible aim and that pledges are adequately funded, as they are very modest. I listened to their manifesto this morning (more of that on the Polls thread) and trust that they are the best option for halting the appalling decline in services for voters.

A vote for the Conservatives promises more austerity and ever longer waiting lists with their pledges to save 17 billion and push weird schemes like conscription on us as "flagship policies".

Nothing can be guaranteed but as Starmer said this morning, "judge us by our actions in government" and we've had plenty of time to judge the Conservatives

Oreo

growstuff from what ferry23 has written on here it’s obviously not apathy.Read her posts.

I have read them and I can see that, but how does anybody nationally know the difference? For all decision makers know, a certain percentage of the population couldn't care less how they're governed.

Germanshepherdsmum

Labour say they will raise an extra £8.6bn in tax receipts by 2028/9. That’s a long way away, and how many times over have they already spent it in their pledges? You will not be surprised to hear me say that it’s all just so much talk.

No idea. I haven't done the maths. Have you?

Is there any mention in Labour's manifesto of Blair, Brown and Mandelson still pulling the strings?

mayisay

Is there any mention in Labour's manifesto of Blair, Brown and Mandelson still pulling the strings?

Why would there be?

There would continue to be austerity with Labour. Starmer has made it clear that there will be cuts. My point is that it’s a long time before enough additional tax revenue comes along to fund their pledges - and nothing has been said about what it will cost to settle with the doctors or how the thousands of additional hospital appointments can appear out of nowhere. I strongly suspect that Labour will be doing a lot of what they are famous for - borrowing.

Change will not come quickly - we all know that. But getting rid of this integrity-free government will at the very least be a start.

I always say, that apart from in Scotland, there are normally about 8 other candidates on the ballot paper.
As I have done on some previous occasions, at the moment anyway, I intend to vote for one of them.

It's interesting both on here and people I talk to just how many people do not know which way to vote. I'm not sure this is going to be a huge win for Labour as predicted.

growstuff

Germanshepherdsmum

Labour say they will raise an extra £8.6bn in tax receipts by 2028/9. That’s a long way away, and how many times over have they already spent it in their pledges? You will not be surprised to hear me say that it’s all just so much talk.

No idea. I haven't done the maths. Have you?

I’m sure you are as capable as anyone of realising that £8.6bn isn’t much in terms of government spending (in 2022/3 the NHS was given £181.7bn) but Labour rely on this small sum - if and when it materialises - to pay for a lot of promises.

And of course anyone who only has SP will be paying tax under Labour because they have refused to match the Conservatives’ promise in that regard. It is not lost on me that Labour constantly say they are the party for working people. I hope people on GN who have to live on a SP heed those words, and the refusal to stop them paying tax.

As if we could change Conservative austerity overnight after 14 years?

Only too well aware.

Labour offered some hope for change in a situation where the disillusionment with a series of PM's has just led to cynicism on the conduct of affairs in public life. Not the bouncing up and down all will be well vote for us hope but "We have to try a change".

I'll settle for a Labour win with a decent majority, Skydancer. I don't agree with their 'more of the same' economic rhetoric, but I do believe that they have the interests of the country at heart.

I think confusion on places like this forum stem from older voters who have always voted tory (which has been the grester part of our demographic). They recognise the damage the tories have done to public services but can't bring themselves to vote Labour. Polling is showing younger voters (under 60s) as much more positive in favour of Labour & other progressive parties.

They seem a bit reluctant to explain why they can't vote Labour, though... But asking for reasons on GNet seems to be a Cardinal Sin...

Voters under about the age of 30 don't even remember who Tony Blair is.

It is not lost on me that Labour constantly say they are the party for working people. I hope people on GN who have to live on a SP heed those words, and the refusal to stop them paying tax.

Well, keep it under your hat, but they plan to euthanise us all. What else could this sinister emphasis on 'working people' possibly mean?