The opinion of the IFS on the parties’ manifestos

Interesting remarks analysing the general election 2024 manifestos, though, from Paul Johnson, Director, Institute for Fiscal Studies, someone on neither side of the election seesaw. The analysis in a few words seems to be that we are between the devil and the deep blue sea.

As far as I’m concerned, better the devil I know.

GSM I am beginning to think that way also.

Good. I wish more people would realise that the only change likely in the near future is VAT on school fees and even more overstuffed state schools.

You already know my views, GSM.

I don't rate the IFS very highly, their economic analysis isn't based on the reality of how governments finance their spending. It's based on the concept of finite amounts of money available which has to be raised by taxation or 'borrowing.'

This is the empirically researched reality:

www.ucl.ac.uk/bartlett/public-purpose/sites/bartlett_public_purpose/files/the_self-financing_state_an_institutional_analysis_of_government_expenditure_revenue_collection_and_debt_issuance_operations_in_the_united_kingdom.pdf

If it’s between the devil and the deep blue sea I’m inclined to agree, better the devil we know than drowning in the deep blue sea.

I’m glad to say I’m not going to be supporting any devils. All the hyperbole about school fees which won’t result in mass private school closures leaves me as unmoved as it leaves 95% of the population.

The devil we know is so spectacularly bad that I can't see why anyone would want to continue supporting it!

Think I’d rather have Reeves as chancellor who at least has a background in the subject ( and Mark Carney think highly of her) than someone that wasn’t a particularly good health Secretary whose austerity cuts made us ill prepared for a pandemic. But the main problem with this Conservative government is that most of the good, decent experienced MP’s have gone and we’re left with the Bravermans, Patels etc. Plus a new intake ( if they get elected) of MP’s with no experience in government at all. The party is tired and fragmented. So it isn’t a case of better the devil we know because we won’t know many of them and those we do know of don’t exactly inspire confidence.

I don’t vote for crime, law breaking, corruption, cronyism or fraud, whatever the colour of the party.

Never have, never will

How many in the shadow cabinet have experience in government MayBee?

We all know the answer to that GSM! I’m sure there were Tories who had no experience in government at some point. Anyway, my younger son is a Civil Servant (I won’t say which Dept) and he says one of the first things they have to do with a new Minister is teach them how to be a Minister. What are their strengths, weaknesses etc.
what will you do GSM when and if Labour are elected?

Put all my money under the mattress.

Germanshepherdsmum

How many in the shadow cabinet have experience in government MayBee?

Thats a non issue, how can they after 14 years?

Current 'experience in government" doesn't inspire confidence.

Depressing but not a surprise. Thanks for posting this the link.

This was in yesterdays Sunday Times."Schools hit by VAT rise could join state sector." Liverpool College converted to the State sector in 2013 , is seen as Liverpool's outstanding co-ed school and the head teacher said private school principals had been contacting the school to ask how they went about converting to the state sector. Interesting.

I'm surprised you didn't see this GSM (page 2) as you saw the article about Keir Starmer or at least a footnote .





ex

Germanshepherdsmum

How many in the shadow cabinet have experience in government MayBee?

Five. Not that the shadow cabinet will necessarily be the ministers in a new government.

Better the devil you know is never a mantra I would follow, particularly when we’ve had 14 years of this devil and it’s made the country worse!

You know who I’ll be voting for. Those of you who choose the devil … fine, your choice🤷‍♀️

When we’ve had fourteen years of Tory mismanagement it is inevitable that here will be few people in the shadow cabinet with government experience. Those who see this as reason for them to be denied it appear to be arguing for a one party state. I’d rather not live under such a regime. Democracy means that there will always be new blood at the end of a long reign from one party.

Well, Labour haven’t been in power for 14 years have they. But they do have people that have been MP’s for a long time like Yvette Cooper, Hilary Benn, Stephen Kinnock, Angela Eagle, Stephen Timms ( who, if you remember, was stabbed a few years ago), Barry Gardiner, David Lammy Chris Bryant, Ed Milliband, Bill Esterson, Rachel Reeves, Alex Cunningham, Liz Kendall, Lisa Nandy, Dan Jarvis,Angela Raynor, Jess Phillips, Thangam Debbonaire, Margaret Greenwood, Tulip Siddiq (who worked tirelessly to obtain release Nazanin from prison)Peter Kyle, Wes Streeting, Rosena Allin Khan. I’d be quite happy to see any of those in the cabinet and quite unashamedly adore some of them! I could then throw in relative newbies like Darren Jones and Rosie Duffield. The Conservative MP’s that I do have respect for theses days I could probably count on the fingers of one hand.

MayBee70

Well, Labour haven’t been in power for 14 years have they. But they do have people that have been MP’s for a long time like Yvette Cooper, Hilary Benn, Stephen Kinnock, Angela Eagle, Stephen Timms ( who, if you remember, was stabbed a few years ago), Barry Gardiner, David Lammy Chris Bryant, Ed Milliband, Bill Esterson, Rachel Reeves, Alex Cunningham, Liz Kendall, Lisa Nandy, Dan Jarvis,Angela Raynor, Jess Phillips, Thangam Debbonaire, Margaret Greenwood, Tulip Siddiq (who worked tirelessly to obtain release Nazanin from prison)Peter Kyle, Wes Streeting, Rosena Allin Khan. I’d be quite happy to see any of those in the cabinet and quite unashamedly adore some of them! I could then throw in relative newbies like Darren Jones and Rosie Duffield. The Conservative MP’s that I do have respect for theses days I could probably count on the fingers of one hand.

It’s choke on your coffee time for some I fear.
www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/article/2024/jun/24/keir-starmer-labour-shadow-cabinet-government-tony-blair-gordon-brown

Thanks Casdon. It’s downright ridiculous the short amount of time some MP’s stayed in their cabinet positions in recent times. Imo Keir will have his cabinet up and running very quickly. I do hope Jess is in it. I know he said that he understood why she stood down but would welcome her back in the future.

Well said MayBee70!

Thanks Casdon for posting that informative article. It’s good to read fully informed facts.