Governments First Budget

“So what sort of income do you think a 500 acre farm would generate?

I agree that 200 acres is more a hobby farm than a profitable farm enterprise, but there's a lot of diversification at that level, surely?”

Typical less than £50k, assuming no borrowings have to be repaid then tax, and living expenses have to be paid out of what’s left.

Diversification, maybe, many dont because they are too remote for that to work, some would have other income from work away from the farm, that’s very difficult for livestock farms

Currently owner occupied farms have resilience, tenanted farms are precarious they only have their livestock or crops as security.

Open letter to the Chancellor on the impact of increased NIC for charities.

www.ncvo.org.uk/news-and-insights/news-index/open-letter-chancellor-national-insurance

As far as I understand it, the CGT on second homes remains the same, post Budget.
It was hiked up last April by the Conservatives from 10% to 18% for basic tax payers.

and where will all the highly qualified staff to operate them come from? It takes years to train staff to operate scanners, they are very highly trained and not well paid, and there aren’t enough staff to fill the vacancies now

Yes, one young woman in our family is one of those highly trained staff and she and colleagues were in such despair at the demands made on them by the NHS and became so stressed some have left, work in the private sector or left the profession altogether.

I spoke to my doctor daughter who is in New Zealand last night, and I told her about the new, much needed MRI scanners we’ve been promised, something I have a particular interest in since I required a scan well over a year ago and NHS pathways have been put in place to ensure that access to an MRI scan is very difficult, even when indicated by NHS consultants. Well, my daughter soon burst my bubble of enthusiasm,

and where will all the highly qualified staff to operate them come from? It takes years to train staff to operate scanners, they are very highly trained and not well paid, and there aren’t enough staff to fill the vacancies now

So there we have it!

Not a lot of people know that, GrannyGravy!
🤔

There have to have been some decisions made so far which seem to be ill-thought through, the consequences of which could impact on Working People and which are tinkering at the edges of this questionable £22billion Black Hole.

MaizieD

^Education business aren’t Academies run as businesses?^

Forgive me if I hadn't noticed, but since when have Academies charged parents for educating their offspring?

They do not MaizieD as you know.

Your previous post VAT is being charged on education businesses. Education shouldn’t be a profit taking exercise

For profit schools are not allowed in the U.K., whether they be State, Academies or Private.

MaizieD

^How will NHS staff manage to find the extra staff needed for the proposed extra beds and diagnostic tests? Medical staff take years to train.^

Perhaps the wage increases will entice back some of the already trained practitioners who have left the NHS over the past few years?

Well, not the ones I know who left because of stress and the more who left, the more stressful it became.

MaizieD

^Why would 200 acres be a hobby farm?^

Because, if David49 is correct, it wouldn't be providing a living for the farmer.

It depends what they are growing.

If you keep a few alpacas on a few acres then that's a hobby farm.

Education business aren’t Academies run as businesses?

Forgive me if I hadn't noticed, but since when have Academies charged parents for educating their offspring?

How will NHS staff manage to find the extra staff needed for the proposed extra beds and diagnostic tests? Medical staff take years to train.

Perhaps the wage increases will entice back some of the already trained practitioners who have left the NHS over the past few years?

Why would 200 acres be a hobby farm?

Because, if David49 is correct, it wouldn't be providing a living for the farmer.

madalene

Allira

One angry farmer in Scotland has many questions for what he calls the "metropolitan elite" in this government: One is - how does farming fit in with Angela Rayner's proposed four day working week?

Well he’s got a point!

What about nurses, doctors, teachers? We can’t employ more because there aren’t more ready cooked just waiting to be employed! Or farmers!

A further £1.5bn will be used to provide extra hospital beds and free up capacity for an additional one million diagnostic tests.

How will NHS staff manage to find the extra staff needed for the proposed extra beds and diagnostic tests? Medical staff take years to train.

Allira

One angry farmer in Scotland has many questions for what he calls the "metropolitan elite" in this government: One is - how does farming fit in with Angela Rayner's proposed four day working week?

Well he’s got a point!

What about nurses, doctors, teachers? We can’t employ more because there aren’t more ready cooked just waiting to be employed! Or farmers!

One angry farmer in Scotland has many questions for what he calls the "metropolitan elite" in this government: One is - how does farming fit in with Angela Rayner's proposed four day working week?

GrannyGravy13

Allira

Perhaps the Government considers farmers to be in the category of Landowners rather than Working People.

🤔

I think you are correct 👍

What has that to do with farming?

🤔

Thanks GG.

I’ll keep my views to myself about people who own 2 or 3 properties to be used as a cash cow.

Allira

Perhaps the Government considers farmers to be in the category of Landowners rather than Working People.

🤔

I think you are correct 👍

LizzieDrip

^This budget is and will hit those who have saved for retirement, invested in a rental instead of a pension pot^

In what way will it hit them? Genuine question.

As I’m not a 2nd home owner I haven’t drilled down into this aspect of the budget. Perhaps those with greater knowledge in this area can inform me.

I know folks who have opted to invest in one or two properties to rent as opposed to investing in a pension plan, shares etc.,

With the higher stamp duty this will make them think twice about future purchases along with the added CGT when they come to sell their existing property/ies

GrannyGravy13

LizzieDrip

… oh, forgot stamp duty increase on 2nd homes - that’s left the highest paid ‘completely untouched’ as well.

Only if they sell them.

Stamp duty is paid when you purchase a property.

We completed on the purchase of our "second home," ie retirement flat, last month. We're glad we missed the increase!
(We're anything but "highest paid.")

Perhaps the Government considers farmers to be in the category of Landowners rather than Working People.

🤔

MaizieD

^The U.K. will be the only country in Europe to charge VAT on education, not something to boast about is it?^

VAT is being charged on education businesses. Education shouldn't be a profit taking exercise.

Play on words MaizieD

VAT is being charged on school fees for those who chose not to go down the conventional route of state education, this is a tax on education.

Education business aren’t Academies run as businesses?

MaizieD

David49

growstuff

Interesting thread by Dan Neidle about IHT on small farms:

threadreaderapp.com/thread/1851956384167776598.html

The figures are misleading because the value under 500k are not commercial farms, it’s been decades since a living can be made from 40acres on a lowland farm. It represents retired farmer who have sold off land over the years and paid CGT on that sale or gifted land previously.

To be commercial 200 acres might be profitable if it’s very intensive, growing crops 500 acres is needed to survive. So the capital there is £6m at current values. IHT on that is substantial, if property has to be sold CGT is payable, add to that sale costs over 30% of value is lost and the reduction in acreage makes the farm uneconomic.

So what sort of income do you think a 500 acre farm would generate?

I agree that 200 acres is more a hobby farm than a profitable farm enterprise, but there's a lot of diversification at that level, surely?

Why would 200 acres be a hobby farm?

Many productive farms are less than 200 acres, or about 70 hectares you prefer, many fruit farms may be less than that.

This budget is and will hit those who have saved for retirement, invested in a rental instead of a pension pot

In what way will it hit them? Genuine question.

As I’m not a 2nd home owner I haven’t drilled down into this aspect of the budget. Perhaps those with greater knowledge in this area can inform me.

The U.K. will be the only country in Europe to charge VAT on education, not something to boast about is it?

VAT is being charged on education businesses. Education shouldn't be a profit taking exercise.