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Witzend

The trouble with major inquiries is that they always seem to cost billions in legal fees.

The big major inquiry - the Independent Inquiry into Child Sexual Abuse took 7 years, reporting in 2022, and cost £186.600.000 pounds

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/alexis-jay-government-laws-liz-truss-iicsa-b2206803.html

(Unfortunately it was released the same day Liz Truss resigned)

It made a slew of recommendations some of which are being carried out, like the specialist police units established

"Grooming Gangs Taskforce arrests hundreds in first year
A dedicated police taskforce set up to bring down grooming gangs has supported police forces in England and Wales to make hundreds of arrests in its first year. "

www.gov.uk/government/news/grooming-gangs-taskforce-arrests-hundreds-in-first-year

clearly a long way to go, and thats where the pressure should go.

but another millions of pounds yet-another-inquiry?

Iam64

Badenoch in the Daily Mail.

*the inquiry I want to see should start by considering the likely racial or religious motivation of these crimes*

Eh? Badenoch was Equalities Minister in the last government. She was in the perfect position to start an investigation into racial and religious motivation.

Inquiries take years, cost millions and are a waste of time because recommendations are not acted on. It’s just kicking the can down the road.

Often the information is readily available and action can be taken without a costly inquiry. This is a purely political move.

growstuff

Iam64

Badenoch in the Daily Mail.

*the inquiry I want to see should start by considering the likely racial or religious motivation of these crimes*

Eh? Badenoch was Equalities Minister in the last government. She was in the perfect position to start an investigation into racial and religious motivation.

Yes - the 2022 Independent Inquiry into Child Sexual Abuse came out just before Sunak took over from Truss and Badenoch was appointed - by a month -

Minister for Women and Equalities
Government Equalities Office
25 October 2022 - 5 July 2024 Commons

Ideally positioned to take action. Every chance.

Louella12
MaizieD
What was wrong with the national enquiry into grooming gangs that reported in 2023?
I think you and others are well aware what's happened since.
Imagine this was a Conservative leader refusing Oldham's request.
You'd be up in arms.

No need to imagine. It’s been widely reported (but apparently not widely enough) that the Conservative government did refuse the same request.

A leaked letter shows that in September 2022, the then minister for safeguarding, Amanda Solloway, wrote to an Oldham councillor dismissing a request for a public inquiry. “It is for the local authorities in individual towns and cities which are responsible for delivering local services, to commission local inquiries,” she wrote.

When PM Sunak took office over 550 arrests were made of grooming gang suspects.

At least 400 vulnerabilities girls were protected.

He and his Ministers acted on the reports.

(Evidence on Gov.UK)

GrannyGravy13

When PM Sunak took office over 550 arrests were made of grooming gang suspects.

At least 400 vulnerabilities girls were protected.

He and his Ministers acted on the reports.

(Evidence on Gov.UK)

But the point still remains that the government refused Oldham's request for a public inquiry, which is what Labour is being criticised for now. Both Yvette Cooper and Jess Phillips asked Oldham to set up their own inquiry.

I’ve been reflecting on the discussions here, In the news media and on mumsnet as well as my experience of the so called grooming gangs.
I’ve posted here about my uncertainty that yet another inquiry will add significant positives to the various inquiries already reported on. Particularly the independent Inquiry into child sexual abuse that reported in 2022, updated June 2023. As gg13 says, as a result of recommendations for specialist police teams to investigate ‘grooming gangs’. This was recommended in my force area in 1998 but didnt happen. I can see the arguments for and against public inquiries but on balance I worry about yet more money and delay whrn we have now adult victims as well as current child victims who need urgent support.

The criticisms of Starmer are, imo, misplaced an unhelpful when our focus should be pushing his govt to implement the recommendations of earlier inquiries.
Starmer became head of the CPS in 2009. The following year, the CPS turned down a case for prosecution. There’s no evidence Starmer was aware of this.
Starmer brought in Nazir Afzal, who overturned the 2009 decision and successfully prosecuted the case. Starmer also changed the guidelines which caused the CPS to reject the case.
Afzal has been positive in his comments about Starmer’s positive work at the CPS

Maremia

The problem now is that there are not enough lawyers to speed up the processing of sex assault cases, as reported in the Guardian online yesterday. This shortage should not be attributed to Labour as they have only just come in to power.

Yet, they very quickly found courts and judges for those who posted Facebook tweets, some of which were straight away delete. No Im not defending any violence.
Yet the violence perpetrated against these children goes into waiting time. Two tier courts??

growstuff

GrannyGravy13

When PM Sunak took office over 550 arrests were made of grooming gang suspects.

At least 400 vulnerabilities girls were protected.

He and his Ministers acted on the reports.

(Evidence on Gov.UK)

But the point still remains that the government refused Oldham's request for a public inquiry, which is what Labour is being criticised for now. Both Yvette Cooper and Jess Phillips asked Oldham to set up their own inquiry.

Yes, the "Grooming Gangs Taskforce details given just up the thread,

www.gov.uk/government/news/grooming-gangs-taskforce-arrests-hundreds-in-first-year

Its the way to go the site has details of how they support victims and prosecute and does have a reference to different backgrounds of gangs and how to treat this.

Its a great initiative and this is what we need more of.

Freya5

Maremia

The problem now is that there are not enough lawyers to speed up the processing of sex assault cases, as reported in the Guardian online yesterday. This shortage should not be attributed to Labour as they have only just come in to power.

Yet, they very quickly found courts and judges for those who posted Facebook tweets, some of which were straight away delete. No Im not defending any violence.
Yet the violence perpetrated against these children goes into waiting time. Two tier courts??

No, because most of the people in the riots pled guilty. The trials for the abusers will take much longer.

Thanks Growstuff
It’s sad it needs repeating over and over

We should stop calling them 'grooming gangs' and call them what they are - Child Rape gangs. These children were farmed out, sold, raped, ignored and abandoned by the police, social services, and government - Labour at that time. The parents were abandoned when they went looking for help.

No one has been held to account.

No one wanted to play the race card, and say what needs to be said about criminals who happen to be a different colour to 'native' English.

I remember being truly shocked by the programme that Channel 4 made - 'Things That We Won't Say About Race That Are True' - in 2015, I think?
I found a review of it by The Guardian (when The Guardian actually had a back bone and cared for women).

www.theguardian.com/tv-and-radio/2015/mar/20/things-we-wont-say-about-race-trevor-phillips

I think it is very difficult to find the programme now, because it will probably have been 'scrubbed clean'.

What am I missing here? It's long been accepted that investigation and prosecution was influenced just as you've said, we have had full inquiries, people prosecuted, and practice has been changed.

So why do we need another inquiry instead of continuing to increase help for current and future victims?

And if the inquiry reporting in 2022 was not adequate, why was another not put in place then?

Here's some food for thought: the Walsall child Abuse enquiry, and how long it took although there were no ethnic issues involved? Years and years?

www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2023/apr/05/twenty-one-convicted-in-west-midlands-child-sexual-abuse-inquiry

An example of thorough investigation leading to successful prosecution. This kind of horrific abuse of children knows no bounds of ethnicity, race, faith or gender. It’s across every community.
I don’t seek to minimise the damage caused by so called grooming gangs and agree labelling them in this way can sanitise the horrific level of abuse they were responsible for.
But we need to remember sexual abuse and exploitation of children knows no limits

Maremia

GB News will use any clickbait to improve its viewing figures.

The audience for GB News keeps rising, and November appeared to be another significant month. According to data from Barb, the TV rating agency, GB News overtook Sky News for live TV viewing across one month for the first time.4 Dec 2024

A very good in depth discussion on Radio 4 this afternoon.
Andrew Norton and Nazir Afzel giving the true story Re kier Starmers role.

www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/m0026ncy

lemsip

Maremia

GB News will use any clickbait to improve its viewing figures.

The audience for GB News keeps rising, and November appeared to be another significant month. According to data from Barb, the TV rating agency, GB News overtook Sky News for live TV viewing across one month for the first time.4 Dec 2024

To put that into context.
pressgazette.co.uk/media-audience-and-business-data/media_metrics/most-popular-websites-news-uk-monthly-2/

petra

A very good in depth discussion on Radio 4 this afternoon.
Andrew Norton and Nazir Afzel giving the true story Re kier Starmers role.

www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/m0026ncy

Excellent discussion with contributors from varied back grounds

Iam64

petra

A very good in depth discussion on Radio 4 this afternoon.
Andrew Norton and Nazir Afzel giving the true story Re kier Starmers role.

www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/m0026ncy

Excellent discussion with contributors from varied back grounds

It was so good to hear the experts who knew/know exactly what was/is going on instead of the world and his wife throwing in their 2 pence worth.
Did you notice Andrew Norton getting emotional talking about that awful court case? He had me going 😥

Yes I did notice Andrew Norton’s distress and was pleased to see the impact of this work acknowledged.

Of course public servants are accountable and everyone involved has acknowledged mistakes were made in the early days. But that doesn’t mean police, health, education, social workers weren’t (in the vast majority) doing all they could to protect these children. Constantly listening to horrors from children you know and care for is tough, especially when trying to keep them in a safe place is impossible.

Andy Burnham has broken ranks with labour and is demanding a lnew and imited enquiry, covering the aspects ie rape gangs that were not covered previously. News just released by GBnews, again in the forefront

I’ve posted on another thread. Read what Andy Burnham said. He and some ministers and Labour mp’s are prepared to consider a time limited, focussed inquiry if that’s what the majority of survivors want, Starmer not opposed.
The vote last night was to scupper the tories attempt to stop the child safety bill - which if in force in the past, could possibly have saved the life of Sara Sharrif.
Jess Phillips when questioned said she was capable of holding two thoughts and providing victims supported a time limited focussed national inquiry she’d accept this.

Starmer, Phillips. Afzal talked about some victims feeling re-traumatised and simply wanting the Jay report implemented. We need sensible well informed calm people like leading this with sensitivity and victims at the centre.

karmalady

Andy Burnham has broken ranks with labour and is demanding a lnew and imited enquiry, covering the aspects ie rape gangs that were not covered previously. News just released by GBnews, again in the forefront

Not accurate at all. See the other thread, last page for full details..

www.gransnet.com/forums/chat/1344066-Labour-has-come-under-fire-after-refusing-to-hold-a-public-inquiry-into-historic-sexual-abuse-by-grooming-gangs-in-Oldham?pg=22

(last page)