All is not well in the world of Reform

I, too, have met Mr Farage and felt that he was acting in his " man- of- the - people " role. I did not feel that I met the real person behind the mask.
Re " stay at home mums" : has Reform any data to back their assertion ? I prefer statements to be backed by research, personally.

FlitterMouse

I think they know that boats cannot be turned back without breaching Maritime law. I think it’s precisely why they are jumping on this latest far-right bandwagon that seeks to paint all Muslim men as rapists with complicit families who must all be deported. Did you listened to Campbell and Stewart on TRIP last week? Chilling stuff. When you listen to this you start to see why Farage might be pushing the idea of stay at home mums - so they might have more children. Reform thinking heading towards Margaret Atwood’s Gilead? No jobs, no money, just have babies.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=JTtqGSwTLO0&t=1718s

Where in the world is that most similar to - countries with fundamentalist Islamic movements. The irony.

I think they know that boats cannot be turned back without breaching Maritime law. I think it’s precisely why they are jumping on this latest far-right bandwagon that seeks to paint all Muslim men as rapists with complicit families who must all be deported. Did you listened to Campbell and Stewart on TRIP last week? Chilling stuff. When you listen to this you start to see why Farage might be pushing the idea of stay at home mums - so they might have more children. Reform thinking heading towards Margaret Atwood’s Gilead? No jobs, no money, just have babies.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=JTtqGSwTLO0&t=1718s

The issue I think they are weak on imo is the one they are possibly most popular on in term of soundbites. Yes, it's "we'll turn back the boats". And if they land, "return the migrants immediately to France". Under international law, this is not possible - unless the French agree.

(Just as, if we want to deport people away from the UK, we have to obtain the permission of the country receiving people, and vice versa)

I've tried so many times for someone who supports Reform to explain the "how" and never had an answer.

(and its not the human rights law, that pertains to a different set of issues).

Explained here:
www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cyxeedx40d8o

The thing I find most depressing is that we may have another four and half years of this noise and disruption.

What fools they made of themselves last week in Parliament. Sarah Champion, MP for Rochdale summed it up when she said how disgusted she was with Rupert Lowe. The atmosphere in the chamber after his vile speech was palpable. And why in the world were these five stooges trying to scupper a bill to protect children? The Speaker labelled their behaviour a shambles. Six months into this Parliament, they should have figured out how things work but they haven’t. Far too busy with their other jobs to knuckle down and learn the process. Lee Anderson should know it but clearly doesn’t.

Reform is never going to be in a position to govern in 2029. In the unlikely event that they could gain enough seats to win an election, they would not be able to form a government as there wouldn't be enough experienced MPs even to form a Cabinet. The questions I posed upthread have met with stony silence because Reform supporters can’t answer them. All fans seem obsessed with is the cult of Farage which is no more than the cult of celebrity with no substance to back it up.

Reform would have to look to 2034 by which time Farage and Tice will both be 70, Lowe 77 and Anderson 68 - assuming they are re-elected or even alive. All too old to take on senior jobs even if they were competent which they are not.

Current Father of the House is Edward Leigh and he’s 74 with decades of Parliamentary experience behind him.

Clacton might finally wake up and realise what a mistake they made last year in electing someone who has no intention of representing one of the most disadvantaged constituencies in the country. At least Carswell and Watling did.

By 2034, the only younger man curently serving as MP would be McMurdock who only won his seat by a tiny margin of less than 100 votes. He’s largely silent apart from parroting what the other four say, following them around like a puppy.

By 2024, he will be 48. Previously he was a junior bank administrator with a very patchy CV. His former boss said he is not be trusted with anything important. In any event, his prison record will always haunt him. A Cabinet position for a man who had served a custodial sentence for a violent attack on a young woman? I don’t think so. And now we have Reform banging on about violent attacks on women. If they were so concerned about this why was there nothing in their now withdrawn election “contract”. I would love to know who it is in Reform who is feeding this stuff to Musk so that he can stir up a social media frenzy - a man who would never have heard of Jess Phillips but for someone feeding him her name.

By 2029 Trump will be gone, quite possibly dead although there are Republicans equally as abhorrent waiting in the wings. Who will Farage pander to then?

Doodledog

When did mothers (or even fathers) not have the choice to stay at home? I wasn't aware that it had ever been disallowed.

How is Farage planning to pay for this? Or is the choice just for those who can afford it? Same as now then.

Maybe Farage is going to pay for it himself from his vast income from NINE jobs!

Jeanathome

Choice for Stay-at-Home Mums or Dads
The majority of mothers would choose to stay at
home more if they could.

There you go! Straight from Reform PLC

How can you possibly speak for “the majority of mothers”?

Yes, let’s keep women at home in the kitchen, where they belong, that’ll be about right!

As for “staying at home til children are 5” if one had two children and was ambitious that could be up to 10 years out of the workplace!

Maremia

So Farage is going to be the next PM? Hadn't he better begin by learning how to be an MP. Attending to his own constituants in Clacton would be a good start. He doesn't have to go there in person, if that would endander him. He could have online consultations. There, one problem solved for him.
He and his party could actually attend the HOC when important issues are being discussed. For example, the sexual abuse scandals that have been highlighted here on GN threads. Seems they were absent from that session.
He would have to be able to function during a debate. Did anyone see, online, the debacle when the Reform Party tried to table an ammendment in the HOC last week? Even the Speaker was driven to comment, 'What a shambles.'
If Farage is going to be the next PM, should he get on with learning the basics.

I completely agree!

www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/nigel-farage-slammed-over-huge-34462708?utm_source=mirror_newsletter&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=main_politics_newsletter&utm_content=&utm_term=&ruid=438d7b2c-a681-4937-9839-d141a305ad5b&hx=8793ebab8b6347791eda3b386fecbb9c83f23add633e82edfa60ea14187e899a

When did mothers (or even fathers) not have the choice to stay at home? I wasn't aware that it had ever been disallowed.

How is Farage planning to pay for this? Or is the choice just for those who can afford it? Same as now then.

MaizieD

I can't be the only person who remembers Harold MacMillan castigating Margaret Thatcher for selling off the family silver....

Oh gosh, that's a blast from the past!

“The sale of assets is common with individuals when they run into financial difficulties. First, the Georgian silver goes, and then all the nice furniture. Then the Canalettos go.” (Couldn't remember what he'd said, so Googled it)

... yes, I was very upset to let go of my Canalettos, too

I wasn't into politics when he was in office, but my mother who was a tad left-wing, liked him, and from what I've discovered since, I do too. Our society might be in a different place if there had been more Conservatives of his calibre.

If you've got the time, there's a very interesting article with some nice illustrations. It's quite long - I'm reading it in stages.

AUSTERITY, AFFLUENCE AND DISCONTENT, 1951 - 1979.

resource.download.wjec.co.uk/vtc/2016-17/16-17_2-12/eng/wjec/never-had-it-so-good.pdf

Casdon

BevSec

Jeanathome

Choice for Stay-at-Home Mums or Dads
The majority of mothers would choose to stay at
home more if they could.

There you go! Straight from Reform PLC

Yes, there are many who probably would prefer to be with their under fives if finances allow, rather than farming them out to nurseries. Its wrong to force mothers back into the workplace if they would rather be at home imo.

Who is that is forcing them back? Is Reform planning to end economic necessity as well as women’s desire to work? Good luck with that.

Its family economics that force them back, difficult to change the situation I know, but very small children need their mothers imo.

BevSec

Jeanathome

Choice for Stay-at-Home Mums or Dads
The majority of mothers would choose to stay at
home more if they could.

There you go! Straight from Reform PLC

Yes, there are many who probably would prefer to be with their under fives if finances allow, rather than farming them out to nurseries. Its wrong to force mothers back into the workplace if they would rather be at home imo.

Who is that is forcing them back? Is Reform planning to end economic necessity as well as women’s desire to work? Good luck with that.

Jeanathome

Choice for Stay-at-Home Mums or Dads
The majority of mothers would choose to stay at
home more if they could.

There you go! Straight from Reform PLC

Yes, there are many who probably would prefer to be with their under fives if finances allow, rather than farming them out to nurseries. Its wrong to force mothers back into the workplace if they would rather be at home imo.

I meant to add MG is now a Chinese car.

Claremont

J52

Yes, of course. I got from the public domain on the internet.

Thank you.

So all those companies were sold to the Chinese NOT by the Labour Party, right?

As far as I know they have been sold over the last few years, I’ve not researched when.
I do know that the brand name MG was sold by the German BMW company. Their adverts come across as very ‘ British’.

Choice for Stay-at-Home Mums or Dads
The majority of mothers would choose to stay at
home more if they could.

There you go! Straight from Reform PLC

I can't be the only person who remembers Harold MacMillan castigating Margaret Thatcher for selling off the family silver....

J52

Yes, of course. I got from the public domain on the internet.

Thank you.

So all those companies were sold to the Chinese NOT by the Labour Party, right?

Freya5

This is all a distraction from what is happening inside this Labour Gov. Reeves in China with her begging bowl, selling off more of our country.
The Labour minister, Siddiq, being investigated by Bangladesh for money laundering. See she's still in post.!
See a Labour MP going against the status quo re child abuse gangs, and its still going on I would say.
Yet all you can do is gaggle on about how bad you think Reform is. Well there's a Gov who is proving to be very bad, perhaps you should look at them.

This is all a distraction from what is happening inside this Labour Gov.

No, it isn't, not at all.

Unless you think we aren't capable of focusing on more than one issue at any one time?

The media, both Left and Right publish news, editorials, etc, about the Labour party, the Tories, and Reform - not to mention international political affairs - often all under one edition. Why should GN's N&P be any different?

If you want to focus on Reeves and the LP - start a thread, and if you also want to make sure that is the only issue to be discussed without reference to other parties or politics, make it clear in your OP.

Reeves in China with her begging bowl, selling off more of our country.

So you accept then that quite a bit's been sold off already - by the previous Tory governments?

Well there's a Gov who is proving to be very bad, perhaps you should look at them.

... but we have! Have you not seen the posts holding Labour to account ("Robber Reeves" is one I remember)?

And what's more, some of us who voted for them have been critical of both Starmer, Reeves, and the direction in which the party appears to be going. Me included.

What is it that you want on here? A political echo-chamber where only the voices condemning Labour are heard, and that we ignore what's going on with the other parties?

Reform is very much in the news - for obvious reasons - and it's going through something of a crisis as a party / business. Give me one good reason why we should not discuss it?

No-one is going to disallow anyone who supports it from commenting are they? They might be challenged on their assumptions - but that's exactly what happens when the Labour government is being discussed on here.

And here's my two-pennorth - if Farage had focused on his constituency, his party members, and our own domestic issues instead of attempting to curry favour with Trump and Musk, both he and Reform might have earned a lot more respect.

If you want to get involved with volatile people - especially if they are rich and powerful, you should also make sure you have the means to keep your distance from them if necessary.

Farage didn't - to corrupt a well-known idiom - he partook of the Devil's hospitality and didn't take a long enough spoon to the table.

endanger

So Farage is going to be the next PM? Hadn't he better begin by learning how to be an MP. Attending to his own constituants in Clacton would be a good start. He doesn't have to go there in person, if that would endander him. He could have online consultations. There, one problem solved for him.
He and his party could actually attend the HOC when important issues are being discussed. For example, the sexual abuse scandals that have been highlighted here on GN threads. Seems they were absent from that session.
He would have to be able to function during a debate. Did anyone see, online, the debacle when the Reform Party tried to table an ammendment in the HOC last week? Even the Speaker was driven to comment, 'What a shambles.'
If Farage is going to be the next PM, should he get on with learning the basics.

There are a lot more below the radar, SMEs and black economy, not just Chinese other Asian, we are suckers letting all the cream go overseas, foreign companies have only one purpose - to take money from us.

That's capitalism for you

I wonder how many of these companies were sold to the Chinese during tory governments?
I was going to say 'sold by' the tories, but many of them, of course, were private sector businesses which were taken over.

Oh, just googled and found a partial answer to my question. Here's a nice informative article for Freya, published in 2012

From the article:

So how did we become so attractive to overseas predators? The answer is that it happened in stages, starting with the removal of regulations on overseas investment by former Tory Chancellor Geoffrey Howe in 1979.

www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/news/article-2129523/How-Britain-sold-half-companies-foreigners.html

UK Companies that are already owned by China or they have shares in.

Logicor (CIC owns a 60 percent stake; other Chinese investors own 30 percent).
Hinkley Point C Nuclear Plant (China General Nuclear Power owns a 33.5 percent stake).
UK Power Networks (owned by Chinese business mogul Li Ka Shing).
Three UK (owned by Li Ka Shing).
Greene King (owned by Li Ka Shing).
Northumbrian Water (owned by Li Ka-Shing).
Neptune Energy (CIC has a 49 percent stake).
Heathrow Airport (CIC has a 10 percent stake).
Thames Water (CIC has a 8.68 percent stake).
20 Fenchurch Street, the Walkie Talkie building (Owned by Lee Kum Kee).
Chiswick Park, London (owned by CIC).
Superdrug (owned by Li Ka-Shing).
Savers Health & Beauty (owned by Li Ka-Shing).
British Steel (owned by Jingye).
The Perfume Shop (owned by Li Ka-Shing).
Clarks Shoes (Viva Capital has a 51 percent stake).
Cineworld (Liu Zaiwang has a 3.48 percent stake).

Just for info.

There are a lot more below the radar, SMEs and black economy, not just Chinese other Asian, we are suckers letting all the cream go overseas, foreign companies have only one purpose - to take money from us.

Casdon

If there had been PR in 2024 though there would still be a Labour led coalition government, so Reform would not be in power.

In 2024 you are correct, but next GE it could be very different Tory plus Reform could easily be a majority whether we had PR or not.

Dont be complacent about this, ignore what Badenough says about Reform they will deal with the devil.

GrannyGravy13

Doodledog it is the U.K. system, which at the moment is the best we can do.

PP would have given Reform many more seats, so I doubt that the Whitehall Gnomes are going to recommend a change in our voting system anytime soon.

I didn’t vote for Labour, but as a business owner I am bitterly disappointed in their fiscal decisions to date.

If they manage to pull of growth good on them, cannot see it myself, particularly in the house building department.

I wasn't commenting on the pro's and con's of PR - just responding to Poppyred's post.

As for 'gaggling on' about Farage and the disintegration of Reform - how is that a 'distraction' from anything happening in the LP in general or the government in particular? The discussion is in direct response to an OP about Reform. At what point does discussion become 'gaggling on' in your book, Freya? At the point where people say things you don't like?